all three considered themselves to be on the paleo diet, but also were raw-food only vegans
Raw-food veganism and paleo type diets are pretty hard to reconcile (though probably less so than regular vegan diets and paleo type diets). There are raw food animal diets but they are quite distinct from raw food veganism and are more similar to standard paleo type diets.
My biggest wonder is whether people work hard enough to eat only wild and grass-fed meats
This is probably the most difficult aspect of the diet to follow strictly due to the relative difficulty and expense of obtaining these types of meat and fish. That’s why most of paleo type diets recommend Omega 3 supplementation and things like Omega 3 enriched eggs.
I feel like the paleo diet is often a convenient excuse for people who want to eat a lot of meat
This sounds to me like being stuck in the mindset that a diet has to be about deprivation or eating foods you don’t particularly enjoy. There’s no reason that healthy foods can’t also be foods you like to eat. As a rule it seems that foods we are evolutionarily adapted to eat are both tasty and nutritious. It’s the ‘super-stimuli’ of refined carbs, refined sugar and processed foods which tend to fit the stereotype of ‘if it tastes good it must be bad for you’.
Glucose is naturally handled really well by the body, but fructose (and by extension, sucrose) is not.
Fructose and sucrose appear to be worse than glucose but it is false to say that glucose is naturally handled really well by the body, at least in the quantities produced by a typical western diet. Much of the harm associated with sugar and refined carbohydrate consumption appears to come from the over-stimulation of the insulin response and resulting blood sugar spikes and crashes caused by eating refined carbs and sugars. Bread is not ‘more sugary’ than table sugar but white bread does have a Glycemic Index that rivals table sugar.
Glucose is an important cellular fuel source and a key component of human metabolism but we are simply not well adapted to deal with the onslaught of glucose produced by consuming grains and refined sugars.
When I said that I considered a raw-food vegan paleo diet nuts, that’s what I meant, that they just seem to difficult to reconcile.
This sounds to me like being stuck in the mindset that a diet has to be about deprivation or eating foods you don’t particularly enjoy.
My statement wasn’t an argument against meat; it was cautionary, and an appropriate response is to point out that I really like eating rice and beans, and should be equally cautious about arguing for their health benefits because of the stake I have in wanting those to be healthful.
My point about bread was that a 4oz piece of bread is not as unhealthy as a 4oz piece of hard candy. I don’t consider refined carbohydrates, or even unrefined but purer carbohydrates (such as potatoes) healthful. I’m having a lot of trouble finding good sources to either back me up or discredit what I’m trying to say (the video linked to earlier is one of the former), but the impression that I’m under is that starch doesn’t cause harmful insulin responses or large insulin spikes if eaten in the much less pure forms; that is, even significant quantities of carbohydrates are digested slowly enough to not cause problems if they are molecularly dispersed among protein, fats, or most especially fiber, and that this is a super-linear effect, more than would be explained simply by eating less of a pure carbohydrate.
but the impression that I’m under is that starch doesn’t cause harmful insulin responses or large insulin spikes if eaten in the much less pure forms; that is, even significant quantities of carbohydrates are digested slowly enough to not cause problems if they are molecularly dispersed among protein, fats, or most especially fiber
I’m not too sure on what differences there are between starch and carbohydrates more generally but I believe it is true that insulin response is lower when carbohydrates are consumed in the form of foods with other components. This is the basic reasoning behind getting your carbs in the form of fruits and vegetables (which also provide plentiful fiber) rather than grains and tubers in paleo type diets. I’ve even seen it claimed that you are better off ordering fries rather than baked potato because the fat slows the rate of absorption but I don’t know how well sourced that is.
Potatoes (not baked), bananas, wild rice and other similar medium GI foods are generally viewed as ok in small quantities by the paleo diet resources I’ve read. They still provoke significantly greater glucose response than things like green vegetables, fruits and berries however while having less overall nutritional value and not significantly greater fiber content.
I bet french fries could be better than a baked potato, but for that to be the case I think they would have to be unsalted (though the potassium in potatoes partially counteracts the salt) and fried in more healthful oils (probably saturated, since heat + unsaturated oil → trans fats). This sounds like an experiment worth performing on myself; I like making french fries, and I could see how satiated I feel after a similar calorie-worth of french fries versus baked potato, and how I feel an hour later (more or less sluggish). I don’t eat much potato in any form, but answering that question (at least with regard to myself) might be a worthy enterprise.
I personally think bananas are great, but it seems like they don’t fit into the paleo scheme because they are so dramatically different than anything that existed in our ancestral environment. Wild potatoes are too toxic for humans to eat, even cooked IIRC.
Raw-food veganism and paleo type diets are pretty hard to reconcile (though probably less so than regular vegan diets and paleo type diets). There are raw food animal diets but they are quite distinct from raw food veganism and are more similar to standard paleo type diets.
This is probably the most difficult aspect of the diet to follow strictly due to the relative difficulty and expense of obtaining these types of meat and fish. That’s why most of paleo type diets recommend Omega 3 supplementation and things like Omega 3 enriched eggs.
This sounds to me like being stuck in the mindset that a diet has to be about deprivation or eating foods you don’t particularly enjoy. There’s no reason that healthy foods can’t also be foods you like to eat. As a rule it seems that foods we are evolutionarily adapted to eat are both tasty and nutritious. It’s the ‘super-stimuli’ of refined carbs, refined sugar and processed foods which tend to fit the stereotype of ‘if it tastes good it must be bad for you’.
Fructose and sucrose appear to be worse than glucose but it is false to say that glucose is naturally handled really well by the body, at least in the quantities produced by a typical western diet. Much of the harm associated with sugar and refined carbohydrate consumption appears to come from the over-stimulation of the insulin response and resulting blood sugar spikes and crashes caused by eating refined carbs and sugars. Bread is not ‘more sugary’ than table sugar but white bread does have a Glycemic Index that rivals table sugar.
Glucose is an important cellular fuel source and a key component of human metabolism but we are simply not well adapted to deal with the onslaught of glucose produced by consuming grains and refined sugars.
When I said that I considered a raw-food vegan paleo diet nuts, that’s what I meant, that they just seem to difficult to reconcile.
My statement wasn’t an argument against meat; it was cautionary, and an appropriate response is to point out that I really like eating rice and beans, and should be equally cautious about arguing for their health benefits because of the stake I have in wanting those to be healthful.
My point about bread was that a 4oz piece of bread is not as unhealthy as a 4oz piece of hard candy. I don’t consider refined carbohydrates, or even unrefined but purer carbohydrates (such as potatoes) healthful. I’m having a lot of trouble finding good sources to either back me up or discredit what I’m trying to say (the video linked to earlier is one of the former), but the impression that I’m under is that starch doesn’t cause harmful insulin responses or large insulin spikes if eaten in the much less pure forms; that is, even significant quantities of carbohydrates are digested slowly enough to not cause problems if they are molecularly dispersed among protein, fats, or most especially fiber, and that this is a super-linear effect, more than would be explained simply by eating less of a pure carbohydrate.
I’m not too sure on what differences there are between starch and carbohydrates more generally but I believe it is true that insulin response is lower when carbohydrates are consumed in the form of foods with other components. This is the basic reasoning behind getting your carbs in the form of fruits and vegetables (which also provide plentiful fiber) rather than grains and tubers in paleo type diets. I’ve even seen it claimed that you are better off ordering fries rather than baked potato because the fat slows the rate of absorption but I don’t know how well sourced that is.
Potatoes (not baked), bananas, wild rice and other similar medium GI foods are generally viewed as ok in small quantities by the paleo diet resources I’ve read. They still provoke significantly greater glucose response than things like green vegetables, fruits and berries however while having less overall nutritional value and not significantly greater fiber content.
People generally eat baked potatoes with butter, cheese, and/or sour cream—not to mention meat.
For practical purposes, the carbs in a baked potato are very likely to be buffered with fat and protein.
I bet french fries could be better than a baked potato, but for that to be the case I think they would have to be unsalted (though the potassium in potatoes partially counteracts the salt) and fried in more healthful oils (probably saturated, since heat + unsaturated oil → trans fats). This sounds like an experiment worth performing on myself; I like making french fries, and I could see how satiated I feel after a similar calorie-worth of french fries versus baked potato, and how I feel an hour later (more or less sluggish). I don’t eat much potato in any form, but answering that question (at least with regard to myself) might be a worthy enterprise.
I personally think bananas are great, but it seems like they don’t fit into the paleo scheme because they are so dramatically different than anything that existed in our ancestral environment. Wild potatoes are too toxic for humans to eat, even cooked IIRC.