Disproof by counterexample: I don’t want to become reflectively consistent in the sense you’re using the phrase.
Edit in response to your edit: the terms autonomous and reflectively consistent are used in the passage you quote to mean different things than you have been using them to mean.
But what do you want? Whatever you want, it is an implicit consistent statement about all time, so the most general wish granted to you consists in establishing a reflectively consistent singleton that implements this statement during all of the future.
For example, I would prefer that people not die, but if some people choose to die, I would not forcibly prevent them, nor would I license any other entity to initiate the use of force for that purpose, so no, I would not wish for a genie that always prevents people from dying no matter what.
I would not wish for a genie that always prevents people from dying no matter what.
What about genies that prevent people from dying conditionally on something, as opposed to always? It’s an artificial limitation you’ve imposed, the FAI can compute its ifs.
Like other people, I care not only about the outcome, but that it was not reached by unethical means; and am prepared to accept that I don’t have a unique ranking order for all outcomes, and that I may be mistaken in some of my preferences, and that I should be more tentative in areas where I am more likely to be mistaken.
Could we aim, ultimately, to build an AGI with such properties? Yes indeed, and if we ever set out to build a self-willed AGI, that is how we should do it—precisely because it would have properties very different from those of the monomaniac utilitarian AGI postulated in most of what’s been written about friendly AI so far.
Yes indeed, and if we ever set out to build a self-willed AGI, that is how we should do it—precisely because it would have properties very different from those of the monomaniac utilitarian AGI postulated in most of what’s been written about friendly AI so far.
Please pin it down: what are you talking about on both accounts (“how we should do it” and “the monomaniac utilitarian AGI”), and where do you place your interpretation of my concept of preference.
I can have a go at that, but a comment box in a thread buried multiple hidden layers down is a pretty cramped place to do it. Figure it’s appropriate for a top-level post? Or we could take it to one of the AGI mailing lists.
I meant to ask for a short indication of what you meant, long description will be a mistake, since you’ll misinterpret a lot of what I meant, given how little of the assumed ideas you agree with or understand the way they are intended.
Signal to humbug ratio on AGI mailing lists is too low.
Well, I had been attempting to give short indications of what I meant already, but I’ll try. Basically, a pure utilitarian (if you could build such an entity of high intelligence, which you can’t) would be a monomaniac, willing to commit any crime in the service of its utility function. That means a ridiculous amount of weight goes onto writing the perfect utility function (which is impossible), and then in an attempt to get around that you end up with lunacy like CEV (which is, very fortunately, impossible), and the whole thing goes off the rails. What I’m proposing is that if anything like a self-willed AGI is ever built, it will have to be done in stages with what it does co-developed with how it does it, which means that by the time it’s being trusted with the capability to do something in the external world, it will already have all sorts of built-in constraints on what it does and how it does it, that will necessarily have been developed along with and be an integral part of the system. That’s the only way it can work (unless we stick to purely smart tool AI, which is also an option), and it means we don’t have to take an exponentially unlikely gamble on writing the perfect utility function.
Well, I feel unable to effectively communicate with you on this topic (the fact that I persisted for so long is due to unusual mood, and isn’t typical—I’ve been answering all comments directed to me for the last day). Good luck, maybe you’ll see the light one day.
Disproof by counterexample: I don’t want to become reflectively consistent in the sense you’re using the phrase.
Edit in response to your edit: the terms autonomous and reflectively consistent are used in the passage you quote to mean different things than you have been using them to mean.
But what do you want? Whatever you want, it is an implicit consistent statement about all time, so the most general wish granted to you consists in establishing a reflectively consistent singleton that implements this statement during all of the future.
For example, I would prefer that people not die, but if some people choose to die, I would not forcibly prevent them, nor would I license any other entity to initiate the use of force for that purpose, so no, I would not wish for a genie that always prevents people from dying no matter what.
What about genies that prevent people from dying conditionally on something, as opposed to always? It’s an artificial limitation you’ve imposed, the FAI can compute its ifs.
Like other people, I care not only about the outcome, but that it was not reached by unethical means; and am prepared to accept that I don’t have a unique ranking order for all outcomes, and that I may be mistaken in some of my preferences, and that I should be more tentative in areas where I am more likely to be mistaken.
Could we aim, ultimately, to build an AGI with such properties? Yes indeed, and if we ever set out to build a self-willed AGI, that is how we should do it—precisely because it would have properties very different from those of the monomaniac utilitarian AGI postulated in most of what’s been written about friendly AI so far.
Please pin it down: what are you talking about on both accounts (“how we should do it” and “the monomaniac utilitarian AGI”), and where do you place your interpretation of my concept of preference.
I can have a go at that, but a comment box in a thread buried multiple hidden layers down is a pretty cramped place to do it. Figure it’s appropriate for a top-level post? Or we could take it to one of the AGI mailing lists.
I meant to ask for a short indication of what you meant, long description will be a mistake, since you’ll misinterpret a lot of what I meant, given how little of the assumed ideas you agree with or understand the way they are intended.
Signal to humbug ratio on AGI mailing lists is too low.
Well, I had been attempting to give short indications of what I meant already, but I’ll try. Basically, a pure utilitarian (if you could build such an entity of high intelligence, which you can’t) would be a monomaniac, willing to commit any crime in the service of its utility function. That means a ridiculous amount of weight goes onto writing the perfect utility function (which is impossible), and then in an attempt to get around that you end up with lunacy like CEV (which is, very fortunately, impossible), and the whole thing goes off the rails. What I’m proposing is that if anything like a self-willed AGI is ever built, it will have to be done in stages with what it does co-developed with how it does it, which means that by the time it’s being trusted with the capability to do something in the external world, it will already have all sorts of built-in constraints on what it does and how it does it, that will necessarily have been developed along with and be an integral part of the system. That’s the only way it can work (unless we stick to purely smart tool AI, which is also an option), and it means we don’t have to take an exponentially unlikely gamble on writing the perfect utility function.
Citations needed.
Well, I feel unable to effectively communicate with you on this topic (the fact that I persisted for so long is due to unusual mood, and isn’t typical—I’ve been answering all comments directed to me for the last day). Good luck, maybe you’ll see the light one day.