What I meant was that I saw talk of need for systemic/philosophical change and to update, that talk died down, and what I see now does not seem so different from what I saw then. As Ben points out, there has been little turnover. I don’t see a difference in epistemics of discussions. I don’t see examples of decisions being made using better theories. And so on.
Concretely recently: Reaction to Elizabeth’s post seemed what I would have expected in 2021, from both LW and EA Forum. The whole nonlinear thing was only exposed after Ben Pace put infinite hours into it, otherwise they were plausibly in process of rooting a lot of EA. Etc. My attempts to get various ideas across don’t feel like they’re getting different reactions from EAs than I would have expected in 2021.
Yes, people have realized SBF the particular person was bad, but they have not done much to avoid making more SBFs that I can see? Or to guard against such people if they don’t do exactly the same thing next time?
Situation with common sense morality and honesty seem not to have changed much from where I sit, and note e.g. that Oliver/Ben who interact with them more seem to basically despair on this front.
Reaction to Elizabeth’s post seemed what I would have expected in 2021, from both LW and EA Forum. … My attempts to get various ideas across don’t feel like they’re getting different reactions from EAs than I would have expected in 2021.
Would you mind explaining both of these things? I’m not very plugged in to this sort of thing.
Situation with common sense morality and honesty seem not to have changed much from where I sit, and note e.g. that Oliver/Ben who interact with them more seem to basically despair on this front.
Also curious to understand more about what this means.
What I meant was that I saw talk of need for systemic/philosophical change and to update, that talk died down, and what I see now does not seem so different from what I saw then. As Ben points out, there has been little turnover. I don’t see a difference in epistemics of discussions. I don’t see examples of decisions being made using better theories. And so on.
Concretely recently: Reaction to Elizabeth’s post seemed what I would have expected in 2021, from both LW and EA Forum. The whole nonlinear thing was only exposed after Ben Pace put infinite hours into it, otherwise they were plausibly in process of rooting a lot of EA. Etc. My attempts to get various ideas across don’t feel like they’re getting different reactions from EAs than I would have expected in 2021.
Yes, people have realized SBF the particular person was bad, but they have not done much to avoid making more SBFs that I can see? Or to guard against such people if they don’t do exactly the same thing next time?
Situation with common sense morality and honesty seem not to have changed much from where I sit, and note e.g. that Oliver/Ben who interact with them more seem to basically despair on this front.
I’d be interested in having a call with you + Ben Pace + maybe Habryka or whoever else you like, to discuss in a higher-bandwidth way, if you like.
Yeah actually I would be interested in having a dialogue on this, with yourself and any of the other folks you mention.
Sounds good! Sign me up! :)
Would you mind explaining both of these things? I’m not very plugged in to this sort of thing.
Also curious to understand more about what this means.