Regardless of the reason for the spit Harry would still have to follow through with whatever that is for the signal to be sent back in time to cause the urge to drink. Otherwise it would be like Harry escaping from that locked classroom after Draco tortured him without then going back in time and sending the Professor to let him out.
Jonathan_Elmer
Karma: 254
Why not just chose a muggle institution that has a lot of gold and is corrupt enough you don’t mind stealing from(shouldn’t be hard) and walk in under the cloak of invisibility, alohomora the locks and fill up the bag of holding with gold? I agree that sounds too easy to not already have been done though.
I don’t think the point of the groundhogs day attack was to find a convincing lie. I’m pretty sure the point was to identify a convincing memory. Once that was identified the entire conversation was oblivated and the false memory inserted.
We could try to use a subreddit.
I doubt she remembers any of that conversation.
Alternatively it could have been a way to determine the right memory charm to achieve the desired effect without using legilimency
The Potions Master was frowning thoughtfully, eyes intent. “The reaction to a False Memory Charm is hard to predict in advance, Mr. Potter, without Legilimency. The subjects do not always act as expected, when they first remember the false memories. It would have been a risky ploy. But I suppose that is one way Professor Quirrell could have done it.”.
Maybe the reason McGonagall knew that Dumbledore was behind the Santa Claus portkey is because only the headmaster could create a portkey that would work inside the Hogwarts wards. Quirrell took Harry outside the wards in order to portkey him to Diagon Alley.
Your point still stands though because there are surely other things that they could do.
A lot of the previous speculation was colored by the fact that H&C #2 was insufficiently clever to be Quirrell and insufficiently efficient to be a legilimens, but since then we have found out that legilimency can be detected months later so legilimens are back on the table, and the apparent lack of cleverness could be explained as an artifact of Eliezer trying to help the reader understand what was going on in that confusing passage.
Everyone is back on the table IMO. Here’s my speculation that H&C is Snape.
In the next thread Xachariah pointed out that Quirrel likely has possession of the resurrection stone and was very recently(at that point in the story) told by Harry how to identify it. Given Locke’s observation in his reply that one of the two privacy spells that have been identified is to detect powerful artifacts it would make sense that Quirrel omitted the spell to detect power artifacts because he had the resurrection stone in his possession. I am not sure why the resurrection stone would be useful for the mission, but surely Quirrel could find something interesting to do with it in that context.
There has also been some speculation that Harry’s fathers’s rock is the philosophers stone. I am not sure why people would be storing important artifacts on Harry’s person, but it would be hilarious to find out that Quirrel stored the resurrection stone in Harry’s pouch while he was in there.
Jung vf gur rivqrapr gung Dhveery unf gur Erfheerpgvba Fgbar?
I notice a disturbing similarity between what Dumbledore did with the note he left with the invisibility cloak and the actions of H&C 1. Dumbledore increased Harry’s trust in him by having his motives impugned by a note that he then discredited. Dumbledor arranged for Zabini to achieved the highest possible pinnacle of untrustworthiness and then H&C arranged for Zabini to impugn the motives of Dumbledore to Harry’s mentor.
There has been some speculation that Snape is H&C, but what has been lacking as far as I can tell is motive. I may have one. Cannon Snape was a Death Eater who only came over to Dumbledor’s side because he wanted to try to save Lilly and then stayed on his side in order to help protect Harry out of respect for Lilly’s sacrifice.
However, in chapter 27 Snape has a conversation with Harry and Snape says that he almost killed harry due to the degree that he was offended and that he gained a new understanding of what Lilly saw in Harry’s father. If Snape really did have a rage inducing revelation in that conversation then that could be enough for him to abandon his role as Harry’s protector. If that happened then it means that Harry, pretending to be wise, took the only thing he had left really. Snape then would have nothing to keep him on Dumbledor’s side, and he knows the dark lord is returning and is destined to a fight to the finish with Harry.
I think Snape is plotting against Harry for revenge and to curry favour with the dark lord.
Snape pulled the plot with Zabini to separate Harry from Dumbledor. Snape escalated SPEW to hurt Hermione. When Snapes plan(whatever it was) was foiled by Quirrels intervention in the final SPEW battle he took the opportunity of his publicly smacking her down to memory charm her into obsession in order to set up the current plot.
ETA: From Chapter 71:
The Potions Master was frowning thoughtfully, eyes intent. “The reaction to a False Memory Charm is hard to predict in advance, Mr. Potter, without Legilimency. The subjects do not always act as expected, when they first remember the false memories. It would have been a risky ploy. But I suppose that is one way Professor Quirrell could have done it.”
That’s what the groundhogs day attack was all about! It was Snape figuring out the details of an effective memory charm to start the obsession without using Legilimency!
Yep, Anarcho-capitalism is the best idea I can think of to fit that bill.
We don’t know that Snape wanted to eliminate bullies. Snape’s intervention in SPEW battles caused a serious escalation in the conflict, but it was Quirrel’s intervention in the final battle that continued the escalation to the point where something had to be done to stop it. We do not know what Snape’s intention was for that final battle.
Harry also knows that Quirrell is an unregistered animagus.
Ya, it turns out that mark can be seen months later. I did not expect that.
Really, all I have to do is describe someone as not a good guy and you accuse me of having a two-color view?
The sticking point in my mind is that the groundhogs day attack should have been a lot more efficient if the attacker was a legilimens.
Abg fher vs Ryvrmre erjevgvat gur tebhaqubtf qnl nggnpx pbhagf nf “vafvqre vasbezngvba.” Ebg13vat vg whfg gb or fher.
Guvaxvat nobhg guvf unf oebhtug nabgure vqrn gb zvaq. Gur nccnerag vapbzcrgrapr bs gur tebhaqubtf qnl nggnpx vf jung ernyyl pbashfrq zr bevtvanyyl nobhg gur vqragvgl bs U&P. Znal crbcyr zvfhaqrefgbbq jung unccrarq gurer naq Ryvrmre unq gb tb onpx naq erjevgr vg n ovg. Jung vs gung nccnerag vapbzcrgrapr jnf whfg n fvqr rssrpg bs Ryvrmre gelvat gb uryc gur ernqre haqrefgnaq JGS vf tbvat ba?
Gnxvat gung vagb nppbhag pnhfrf zl cebonovyvgl bs U&P orvat Dhveery be Fancr gb tb jnl hc.
That is a good point. I would love for it to turn out that Eliezer reversed what Rowling did with Snape. I don’t think that you can abuse generations of children, for any reason, and still come out the other side of it a good guy.
It would be just like Eliezer to add another level to Cannon Snape’s deception. Bad pretending to be good pretending to be bad. shudder
Every possible result is a negative for Harry when his closest ally is accused of murdering his next closest ally. Even if he “wins” it is going to hurt, and it did. I can’t square that with the motives of someone who wants to make Harry dark and strong. It is a big risk, especially when you are stuck in an interrogation cell for the grand finale.