You know, I didn’t realize until just now what it was that seemed off about Draco’s account of the duel with Grindelwald. He said (quote) “there’s no way two wizards would be so exactly matched that they’d fight for twenty whole hours until one of them fell over from exhaustion”, and used this improbability as evidence that the fight had been staged.
Fact from canon that I don’t believe has been mentioned in MoR (and thus may not be MoR canon): Gur Ryqre Jnaq unf gur negvsnpg-yriry cebcregl bs ‘haorngnoyr va pbzong’, ohg jvryqref pbhyq or xvyyrq ol, sbe vafgnapr, nffnffvangvat gurz va gurve fyrrc.
Speculation: Qhzoyrqber pbhyqa’g npghnyyl qrsrng gur Ryqre Jnaq va n qhry- ur whfg bhgynfgrq vgf jvryqre.
It seems obvious in retrospect, but since I didn’t think of it until now maybe others haven’t either. Unless you have some other reason to think it was faked...?
Gur Ryqre Jnaq unf gur negvsnpg-yriry cebcregl bs ‘haorngnoyr va pbzong’, ohg jvryqref pbhyq or xvyyrq ol, sbe vafgnapr, nffnffvangvat gurz va gurve fyrrc.
Is this fact in canon? That seems to be the legend but I don’t think it was ever explicitly confirmed.
I don’t have my copy of HP7 or Tales of Beedle the Bard, but the Elder Wand article in the Harry Potter wiki seems to cite Dumbledore disagreeing with this statement in his commentary on Bard.
Yes, but it’s not clear that this means the same thing. Killing in their sleep somebody who relied on the Elder Wand for protection makes you the new master of the wand, but you didn’t defeat them in a duel.
I believe she stated that Qhzoyrqber jnf vasnghngrq jvgu Tevaqryjnyq, naq Tevaqryjnyq xarj vg, ohg qvqa’g erpvcebpngr.
I think that the whole thing about the wielder of the Elder Wand being unbeatable in a duel was mythic exaggeration in the original canon; it was just a lot more powerful than ordinary wands.
You are correct about their relationship. Notice also that Ariana died when Dumbledore was 18 and Grindelwald was 16. (The whole Dumbledore-Grindelwald timeline is sort of screwy, since they part ways and then fight 46 years later, and yet the duel isn’t really separated from their impetuous youth in most of the descriptions I’ve seen.)
I think that the whole thing about the wielder of the Elder Wand being unbeatable in a duel was mythic exaggeration in the original canon; it was just a lot more powerful than ordinary wands.
Very possibly, especially given that the Deathly Hallows are seen as mythical rather than real by most wizards. Even so, beating someone with a strong equipment edge (and presumably a strong Dark ritual edge) through virtue of superior talent, intelligence, and endurance is remarkable. It would be one thing if, like Grindelwald, he stole the wand from its previous owner, or like the second owner he murdered Grindelwald in the middle of the night. Instead, he stood up to a oblubbq pehfu for 20 hours, waiting for his opponent to surrender through exhaustion.
Which explains why Dumbledore might wait (ETA: wait to fight Grindelwald, I mean, not draw out the fight once it started), without wanting to deceive the world or having the motives Draco ascribes to him. It makes Albus look bad in a different way, but given our other knowledge I think it counts as evidence against your interpretation.
You know, I didn’t realize until just now what it was that seemed off about Draco’s account of the duel with Grindelwald. He said (quote) “there’s no way two wizards would be so exactly matched that they’d fight for twenty whole hours until one of them fell over from exhaustion”, and used this improbability as evidence that the fight had been staged.
Fact from canon that I don’t believe has been mentioned in MoR (and thus may not be MoR canon): Gur Ryqre Jnaq unf gur negvsnpg-yriry cebcregl bs ‘haorngnoyr va pbzong’, ohg jvryqref pbhyq or xvyyrq ol, sbe vafgnapr, nffnffvangvat gurz va gurve fyrrc.
Speculation: Qhzoyrqber pbhyqa’g npghnyyl qrsrng gur Ryqre Jnaq va n qhry- ur whfg bhgynfgrq vgf jvryqre.
It seems obvious in retrospect, but since I didn’t think of it until now maybe others haven’t either. Unless you have some other reason to think it was faked...?
Is this fact in canon? That seems to be the legend but I don’t think it was ever explicitly confirmed.
I don’t have my copy of HP7 or Tales of Beedle the Bard, but the Elder Wand article in the Harry Potter wiki seems to cite Dumbledore disagreeing with this statement in his commentary on Bard.
Yes, but it’s not clear that this means the same thing. Killing in their sleep somebody who relied on the Elder Wand for protection makes you the new master of the wand, but you didn’t defeat them in a duel.
That does fit really well.
It turns out that you were right about the concept but wrong about the source. Not bad.
Unless Dumbledore is lying, of course.
It is strongly implied by canon and Word of God (JKR) that: Qhzoyrqber naq Tevaqryjnyq jrer ybiref.
I believe she stated that Qhzoyrqber jnf vasnghngrq jvgu Tevaqryjnyq, naq Tevaqryjnyq xarj vg, ohg qvqa’g erpvcebpngr.
I think that the whole thing about the wielder of the Elder Wand being unbeatable in a duel was mythic exaggeration in the original canon; it was just a lot more powerful than ordinary wands.
You are correct about their relationship. Notice also that Ariana died when Dumbledore was 18 and Grindelwald was 16. (The whole Dumbledore-Grindelwald timeline is sort of screwy, since they part ways and then fight 46 years later, and yet the duel isn’t really separated from their impetuous youth in most of the descriptions I’ve seen.)
Very possibly, especially given that the Deathly Hallows are seen as mythical rather than real by most wizards. Even so, beating someone with a strong equipment edge (and presumably a strong Dark ritual edge) through virtue of superior talent, intelligence, and endurance is remarkable. It would be one thing if, like Grindelwald, he stole the wand from its previous owner, or like the second owner he murdered Grindelwald in the middle of the night. Instead, he stood up to a oblubbq pehfu for 20 hours, waiting for his opponent to surrender through exhaustion.
Which explains why Dumbledore might wait (ETA: wait to fight Grindelwald, I mean, not draw out the fight once it started), without wanting to deceive the world or having the motives Draco ascribes to him. It makes Albus look bad in a different way, but given our other knowledge I think it counts as evidence against your interpretation.