Gonna post a top-level post about it once it’s made it through editing, but basically the wavefunction is a way to embed a quantum system in a deterministic system, very closely analogous to how a probability function allows you to embed a stochastic system into a deterministic system. So just like how taking the math literally for QM means believing that you live in a multiverse, taking the math literally for probability also means believing that you live in a multiverse. But it seems philosophically coherent for me to believe that we live in a truly stochastic universe rather than just a deterministic probability multiverse, so it also feels like it should be philosophically coherent that we live in a truly quantum universe.
Before I answer that question: do you know what I mean by a truly stochastic universe? If so, how would you explain the concept of true ontologically fundamental stochasticity to a mind that does not know what it means?
I think by “truly stochastic” you mean that multiple future outcomes are possible, rather than one inevitable outcome. You don’t merely mean “it’s absolutely physically impossible to take the necessary measurements to predict things” or “a coin flip is pretty much random for all intents & purposes”. That’s my guess.
Kind of, because “multiple future outcomes are possible, rather than one inevitable outcome” could sort of be said to apply to both true stochasticity and true quantum mechanics. With true stochasticity, it has to evolve by a diffusion-like process with no destructive interference, whereas for true quantum mechanics, it has to evolve by a unitary-like process with no information loss.
So to a mind that can comprehend probability distributions, but intuitively thinks they always describe hidden variables or frequencies or whatever, how does one express true stochasticity, the notion where a probability distribution of future outcomes are possible (even if one knew all the information that currently exists), but only one of them happens?
I’ve been arguing before that true randomness cannot be formalized, and therefore Kolmogorov Complexity(stochastic universe) = ∞. But ofc then the out-of-model uncertainty dominates the calculation, mb one needs a measure with a randomness primitive. (If someone thinks they can explain randomness in terms of other concepts, I also wanna see it.)
Gonna post a top-level post about it once it’s made it through editing, but basically the wavefunction is a way to embed a quantum system in a deterministic system, very closely analogous to how a probability function allows you to embed a stochastic system into a deterministic system. So just like how taking the math literally for QM means believing that you live in a multiverse, taking the math literally for probability also means believing that you live in a multiverse. But it seems philosophically coherent for me to believe that we live in a truly stochastic universe rather than just a deterministic probability multiverse, so it also feels like it should be philosophically coherent that we live in a truly quantum universe.
What do you mean by “a truly quantum universe”?
Before I answer that question: do you know what I mean by a truly stochastic universe? If so, how would you explain the concept of true ontologically fundamental stochasticity to a mind that does not know what it means?
I think by “truly stochastic” you mean that multiple future outcomes are possible, rather than one inevitable outcome. You don’t merely mean “it’s absolutely physically impossible to take the necessary measurements to predict things” or “a coin flip is pretty much random for all intents & purposes”. That’s my guess.
Kind of, because “multiple future outcomes are possible, rather than one inevitable outcome” could sort of be said to apply to both true stochasticity and true quantum mechanics. With true stochasticity, it has to evolve by a diffusion-like process with no destructive interference, whereas for true quantum mechanics, it has to evolve by a unitary-like process with no information loss.
So to a mind that can comprehend probability distributions, but intuitively thinks they always describe hidden variables or frequencies or whatever, how does one express true stochasticity, the notion where a probability distribution of future outcomes are possible (even if one knew all the information that currently exists), but only one of them happens?
I’ve been arguing before that true randomness cannot be formalized, and therefore Kolmogorov Complexity(stochastic universe) = ∞. But ofc then the out-of-model uncertainty dominates the calculation, mb one needs a measure with a randomness primitive. (If someone thinks they can explain randomness in terms of other concepts, I also wanna see it.)