With regards to God in particular: God exists in a lot of peoples’ heads. He’s a massively parallel distributed cognitive algorithm that millions of people use and model. . . . In that sense, and it is an important sense, God is very real. More than that, all memes (memetic algorithms) are real.
But that’s not the sense that theists mean when they say “God is real”, and it’s definitely not the sense that atheists mean when they say “God isn’t real”. When someone says “God isn’t real”, it’s not like they’re saying that God is not a meme that exists in anybody’s mind — a person needs to have their own mental copy of the God algorithm, and the understanding that millions of people share it, in order to even bother being an atheist. It’s pretty clear that they mean that the God algorithm isn’t a model of any actual agent that created the universe or acts on it independently of the humans modeling him.
So I’d disagree with “In that sense, and it is an important sense, God is very real.” Clearly in that sense God is real, but it seems like a profoundly unimportant sense to me, particularly because I don’t think anyone actually uses “real” that way. It seems like a type error; a god is an extremely different sort of thing than the idea of a god.
But that’s not the sense that theists mean when they say “God is real”, and it’s definitely not the sense that atheists mean when they say “God isn’t real”.
Indeed. God is the omniscient, omnipresent, infinitely powerful and utterly non-existent creator of the universe! Cognitive algorithms are cognitive algorithms. Sometimes they make people say the word ‘God’.
Clearly in that sense God is real, but it seems like a profoundly unimportant sense to me, particularly because I don’t think anyone actually uses “real” that way. It seems like a type error; a god is an extremely different sort of thing than the idea of a god
You’re right.
I suppose I’m just ignoring the unimportant senses because I’m talking to rationalists about what ‘God’ could be thought of as, and, well, the other more common ways of thinking about it don’t convey much information. I was mostly trying to convey an ontology of cognitive algorithms, but got sidetracked into talking about this God business via a request from the audience. I honestly don’t care much about how typical theists or atheists use the words, because, well, I don’t care what they think. ;) I think I managed to get my points across despite defecting in the words game. Still, my apologies.
Also something very much like the actual God exists in a Tegmark multiverse, but that’s also pretty unimportant, decision theoretically speaking. He’s just another counterfactual terrorist.
Also something very much like the actual God exists in a Tegmark multiverse, but that’s also pretty unimportant, decision theoretically speaking. He’s just another counterfactual terrorist.
Really? It sounds kinda like a self-defeating object. My guess is that there is an unending infinite hierarchy. But I don’t trust my intuitions about the large scale structure of the multiverse much.
But that’s not the sense that theists mean when they say “God is real”, and it’s definitely not the sense that atheists mean when they say “God isn’t real”. When someone says “God isn’t real”, it’s not like they’re saying that God is not a meme that exists in anybody’s mind — a person needs to have their own mental copy of the God algorithm, and the understanding that millions of people share it, in order to even bother being an atheist. It’s pretty clear that they mean that the God algorithm isn’t a model of any actual agent that created the universe or acts on it independently of the humans modeling him.
So I’d disagree with “In that sense, and it is an important sense, God is very real.” Clearly in that sense God is real, but it seems like a profoundly unimportant sense to me, particularly because I don’t think anyone actually uses “real” that way. It seems like a type error; a god is an extremely different sort of thing than the idea of a god.
Indeed. God is the omniscient, omnipresent, infinitely powerful and utterly non-existent creator of the universe! Cognitive algorithms are cognitive algorithms. Sometimes they make people say the word ‘God’.
You’re right.
I suppose I’m just ignoring the unimportant senses because I’m talking to rationalists about what ‘God’ could be thought of as, and, well, the other more common ways of thinking about it don’t convey much information. I was mostly trying to convey an ontology of cognitive algorithms, but got sidetracked into talking about this God business via a request from the audience. I honestly don’t care much about how typical theists or atheists use the words, because, well, I don’t care what they think. ;) I think I managed to get my points across despite defecting in the words game. Still, my apologies.
Also something very much like the actual God exists in a Tegmark multiverse, but that’s also pretty unimportant, decision theoretically speaking. He’s just another counterfactual terrorist.
Really? It sounds kinda like a self-defeating object. My guess is that there is an unending infinite hierarchy. But I don’t trust my intuitions about the large scale structure of the multiverse much.