If you are going to rape people then you don’t need PUA. It’d be kind of redundant.
What I’m talking about is techniques that get people to let you stick your dick in them. Many of these techniques grow more effective as they are intensified, but also less ethical after a certain point. “Get them drunk” is an example, but not PUA. Better examples would be persevering (necessary to pass simple shit-tests, but nagging too much will make people so desperate to be left alone they may well agree to sex), and intermittent reinforcement (ranging from not being a spineless, clingy sycophant, to emotional abuse).
What on earth are you talking about?
Consider the difference between the slut and the quality girl. Also the phrase “pumped and dumped”.
This belief is useful because if a woman agrees to sex early, you can think that you’re worth more than her, and display related behaviors (making her chase you and fear competition); moreover, if you get sex by promising to call the next day but don’t, you don’t have to feel guilty because she’s just a slut anyway.
(..., but nagging too much will make people so desperate to be left alone they may well agree to sex)
I have a very hard time imagining this working. Women and men of high social status have very effective ways of getting rid of people that fall short of sex. Also constant “nagging” signals horrible things about you in pure fitness terms, it much reduces one’s attractiveness, I can’t see why this would be rewarded with sex.
Sex with a woman might happen in spite of nagging, not because of it.
In my mind, “nagging” in this context meant repeating a request such that the other person changed their response to the request rather than be subjected to further pestering, not pulling down a girl’s pants time and time again until she stopped saying no and said neither yes nor no.
I have a very hard time imagining this working. … I can’t see why this would be rewarded with sex.
And yet it happens. People get pressured into sex.
There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy. If you missed this, you should become less confident in your ability to make accurate judgments in this arena.
I am simply saying its not a good tactic in the context of situations that PUA usually focuses on.
Note that pressure =/= nagging. For it to be pressure you need to have some social or physical leverage over the other person. Nagging dosen’t imply you have either and in their absence the word brings up associations of begging. It is hard to gain great leverage on people of high social status.
nagging too much will make people so desperate to be left alone they may well agree to sex
I have a very hard time imagining this working… I can’t see why this would be rewarded with sex. Sex with a woman might happen in spite of nagging, not because of it.
You also talked about PUA, but the above is a simple claim of fact which is incorrect.
persevering (necessary to pass simple shit-tests, but nagging too much will make people so desperate to be left alone they may well agree to sex)
This was given as a better example of a potential PUA tactic that could be unethical. I was implicitly taking and critiquing the course of action as a tactic a PUA would or would not adopt based on how effective or ineffective it was. I thought it obvious, but looking back I see I should have made an explicit mention of PUA in the comment.
I think the point here isn’t that people don’t get pressured into sex but rather that the specific strategy mentioned isn’t one that PUAs would use because it is both pathetic and a highly ineffective strategy for them to be using. So if a completely amoral PUA was using unethical tactics to get laid he would still not use this one because he wouldn’t expect this one to work.
nagging too much will make people so desperate to be left alone they may well agree to sex
I have a very hard time imagining this working… I can’t see why this would be rewarded with sex. Sex with a woman might happen in spite of nagging, not because of it.
This is NOT me saying “evil PUAs do this”, it’s “orthogonal to your points about PUA, you have made a simple factual claim backed by personal incredulity which is, in fact, false”.
I think you need to give us the definition of PUA you are using, because you seem to be using one that excludes a lot of actions or strategies which one might think would be advantageous to a person who wants to get laid, and unethical persons who want to get laid seem highly likely to be a subgroup of people perusing and participating in a hypothetical discussion of PUA that tabooed all ethical criticism.
What I’m talking about is techniques that get people to let you stick your dick in them. Many of these techniques grow more effective as they are intensified, but also less ethical after a certain point. “Get them drunk” is an example, but not PUA. Better examples would be persevering (necessary to pass simple shit-tests, but nagging too much will make people so desperate to be left alone they may well agree to sex), and intermittent reinforcement (ranging from not being a spineless, clingy sycophant, to emotional abuse).
Consider the difference between the slut and the quality girl. Also the phrase “pumped and dumped”.
This belief is useful because if a woman agrees to sex early, you can think that you’re worth more than her, and display related behaviors (making her chase you and fear competition); moreover, if you get sex by promising to call the next day but don’t, you don’t have to feel guilty because she’s just a slut anyway.
I have a very hard time imagining this working. Women and men of high social status have very effective ways of getting rid of people that fall short of sex. Also constant “nagging” signals horrible things about you in pure fitness terms, it much reduces one’s attractiveness, I can’t see why this would be rewarded with sex.
Sex with a woman might happen in spite of nagging, not because of it.
I meant that.
In my mind, “nagging” in this context meant repeating a request such that the other person changed their response to the request rather than be subjected to further pestering, not pulling down a girl’s pants time and time again until she stopped saying no and said neither yes nor no.
Yes, nagging and pulling down pants are definitely entirely different things. The latter is more ethically grey while the former is more pathetic.
And yet it happens. People get pressured into sex.
There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy. If you missed this, you should become less confident in your ability to make accurate judgments in this arena.
Obviously pressured sex happens.
I am simply saying its not a good tactic in the context of situations that PUA usually focuses on.
Note that pressure =/= nagging. For it to be pressure you need to have some social or physical leverage over the other person. Nagging dosen’t imply you have either and in their absence the word brings up associations of begging. It is hard to gain great leverage on people of high social status.
My point was not about PUA. You said:
You also talked about PUA, but the above is a simple claim of fact which is incorrect.
The post was a response to:
This was given as a better example of a potential PUA tactic that could be unethical. I was implicitly taking and critiquing the course of action as a tactic a PUA would or would not adopt based on how effective or ineffective it was. I thought it obvious, but looking back I see I should have made an explicit mention of PUA in the comment.
I think the point here isn’t that people don’t get pressured into sex but rather that the specific strategy mentioned isn’t one that PUAs would use because it is both pathetic and a highly ineffective strategy for them to be using. So if a completely amoral PUA was using unethical tactics to get laid he would still not use this one because he wouldn’t expect this one to work.
Well, sure. I was taking issue specifically with Konkvistador’s post, above, and the claim:
This is NOT me saying “evil PUAs do this”, it’s “orthogonal to your points about PUA, you have made a simple factual claim backed by personal incredulity which is, in fact, false”.
I think you need to give us the definition of PUA you are using, because you seem to be using one that excludes a lot of actions or strategies which one might think would be advantageous to a person who wants to get laid, and unethical persons who want to get laid seem highly likely to be a subgroup of people perusing and participating in a hypothetical discussion of PUA that tabooed all ethical criticism.