Or that they do but we shouldn’t point this fact out?
I generally prefer to leave that to the psychiatrists. But: 1. calling someone crazy is a more aggressive act when they are not in fact crazy than when they are, and 2. even when they are, yes, there is something aggressive about it. I did not say (and do not believe) that aggression is always wrong.
the general social aggression against people who think they’re Jesus.
Actually, I’m not sure I’ve seen any. Perhaps because those people are (1) extremely rare and (2) usually confined in mental institutions because their thinking is sufficiently generally and seriously disordered that they can’t well cope with life in the world at large. Transgender people are much more common and are generally about as capable of rational thought as the rest of the population.
Actually, I’m not sure I’ve seen any. Perhaps because those people are (1) extremely rare and (2) usually confined in mental institutions because their thinking is sufficiently generally and seriously disordered that they can’t well cope with life in the world at large. Transgender people are much more common and are generally about as capable of rational thought as the rest of the population.
Transgender people are less then .01% of the population. Also being transgender the the currently fashionable form of insanity, if you go back 50-60 years you’d see even fewer “transgender” and a lot more Messiahs.
Transgender people are less than .01% of the population.
What percentage of the population would you guess is made up of people who think they are Jesus?
Incidentally, more recent studies tend to find much higher proportions of transgender people, which presumably is not unrelated to what you describe as its being “the currently fashionable form of insanity”. I don’t think you get to claim both <0.01% and that it was a lot fewer 50 years ago.
Terminology note: If I understand what is going on here, VoiceOfRa is probably using transgender to mean people who want to change male-to-female or female-to-male, and are making a serious attempt at it (sexual reassignment surgery, hormone therapy, or the like). This is not an uncommon usage, but is not the most precise usage; this would more specifically be referred to transsexual.
This may be relevant because the stats quoted appear to apply specifically to transsexuals, not to the larger class transgender (which includes anyone who feels that that their cis-gender does not apply to them). This is true regardless of whether you believe that either or both classes are delusional.
I am not certain if gjm intends to refer to transgender or transsexual folk in eir arguments.
Given that VoR has referred to the same people as “men claiming to be women”, “trannies”, “transgender people”, “people who are claiming to be ‘transsexual’”, and “trans-‘women’”, I think it’s reasonable to guess that he isn’t being super-careful about terminology.
I’ve been trying to make what I say broadly enough applicable that it applies to all trans people, except when replying to specific claims about a smaller group. I don’t guarantee that I’ve been careful enough every time.
(which includes anyone who feels that that their cis-gender does not apply to them)
How is that at all a workable definition? It strikes me as sufficiently vague that it could potentially apply to anyone with a little shoehorning. Is a boy who doesn’t want to play sports as much as the other boys “transgender”, probably not, but with a little creativity a school councilor who feels like being “progressive” could probably make argue that he is.
I don’t really care if it is workable. I was just clarifying what the statistics you two were using applied to. You can also have statistics on people who believe that they are Jesus, regardless of whether that is workable.
(2) usually confined in mental institutions because their thinking is sufficiently generally and seriously disordered that they can’t well cope with life in the world at large.
The fact that society does confine someone to a mental institution is a strong statement.
Of course not.
I generally prefer to leave that to the psychiatrists. But: 1. calling someone crazy is a more aggressive act when they are not in fact crazy than when they are, and 2. even when they are, yes, there is something aggressive about it. I did not say (and do not believe) that aggression is always wrong.
Actually, I’m not sure I’ve seen any. Perhaps because those people are (1) extremely rare and (2) usually confined in mental institutions because their thinking is sufficiently generally and seriously disordered that they can’t well cope with life in the world at large. Transgender people are much more common and are generally about as capable of rational thought as the rest of the population.
Transgender people are less then .01% of the population. Also being transgender the the currently fashionable form of insanity, if you go back 50-60 years you’d see even fewer “transgender” and a lot more Messiahs.
What percentage of the population would you guess is made up of people who think they are Jesus?
Incidentally, more recent studies tend to find much higher proportions of transgender people, which presumably is not unrelated to what you describe as its being “the currently fashionable form of insanity”. I don’t think you get to claim both <0.01% and that it was a lot fewer 50 years ago.
Terminology note: If I understand what is going on here, VoiceOfRa is probably using transgender to mean people who want to change male-to-female or female-to-male, and are making a serious attempt at it (sexual reassignment surgery, hormone therapy, or the like). This is not an uncommon usage, but is not the most precise usage; this would more specifically be referred to transsexual.
This may be relevant because the stats quoted appear to apply specifically to transsexuals, not to the larger class transgender (which includes anyone who feels that that their cis-gender does not apply to them). This is true regardless of whether you believe that either or both classes are delusional.
I am not certain if gjm intends to refer to transgender or transsexual folk in eir arguments.
Given that VoR has referred to the same people as “men claiming to be women”, “trannies”, “transgender people”, “people who are claiming to be ‘transsexual’”, and “trans-‘women’”, I think it’s reasonable to guess that he isn’t being super-careful about terminology.
I’ve been trying to make what I say broadly enough applicable that it applies to all trans people, except when replying to specific claims about a smaller group. I don’t guarantee that I’ve been careful enough every time.
How is that at all a workable definition? It strikes me as sufficiently vague that it could potentially apply to anyone with a little shoehorning. Is a boy who doesn’t want to play sports as much as the other boys “transgender”, probably not, but with a little creativity a school councilor who feels like being “progressive” could probably make argue that he is.
I don’t really care if it is workable. I was just clarifying what the statistics you two were using applied to. You can also have statistics on people who believe that they are Jesus, regardless of whether that is workable.
That’s a perfectly workable definition, assuming you restrict to people who go around expressing this belief.
The fact that society does confine someone to a mental institution is a strong statement.
Would you care to elaborate?