Terminology note: If I understand what is going on here, VoiceOfRa is probably using transgender to mean people who want to change male-to-female or female-to-male, and are making a serious attempt at it (sexual reassignment surgery, hormone therapy, or the like). This is not an uncommon usage, but is not the most precise usage; this would more specifically be referred to transsexual.
This may be relevant because the stats quoted appear to apply specifically to transsexuals, not to the larger class transgender (which includes anyone who feels that that their cis-gender does not apply to them). This is true regardless of whether you believe that either or both classes are delusional.
I am not certain if gjm intends to refer to transgender or transsexual folk in eir arguments.
Given that VoR has referred to the same people as “men claiming to be women”, “trannies”, “transgender people”, “people who are claiming to be ‘transsexual’”, and “trans-‘women’”, I think it’s reasonable to guess that he isn’t being super-careful about terminology.
I’ve been trying to make what I say broadly enough applicable that it applies to all trans people, except when replying to specific claims about a smaller group. I don’t guarantee that I’ve been careful enough every time.
(which includes anyone who feels that that their cis-gender does not apply to them)
How is that at all a workable definition? It strikes me as sufficiently vague that it could potentially apply to anyone with a little shoehorning. Is a boy who doesn’t want to play sports as much as the other boys “transgender”, probably not, but with a little creativity a school councilor who feels like being “progressive” could probably make argue that he is.
I don’t really care if it is workable. I was just clarifying what the statistics you two were using applied to. You can also have statistics on people who believe that they are Jesus, regardless of whether that is workable.
Terminology note: If I understand what is going on here, VoiceOfRa is probably using transgender to mean people who want to change male-to-female or female-to-male, and are making a serious attempt at it (sexual reassignment surgery, hormone therapy, or the like). This is not an uncommon usage, but is not the most precise usage; this would more specifically be referred to transsexual.
This may be relevant because the stats quoted appear to apply specifically to transsexuals, not to the larger class transgender (which includes anyone who feels that that their cis-gender does not apply to them). This is true regardless of whether you believe that either or both classes are delusional.
I am not certain if gjm intends to refer to transgender or transsexual folk in eir arguments.
Given that VoR has referred to the same people as “men claiming to be women”, “trannies”, “transgender people”, “people who are claiming to be ‘transsexual’”, and “trans-‘women’”, I think it’s reasonable to guess that he isn’t being super-careful about terminology.
I’ve been trying to make what I say broadly enough applicable that it applies to all trans people, except when replying to specific claims about a smaller group. I don’t guarantee that I’ve been careful enough every time.
How is that at all a workable definition? It strikes me as sufficiently vague that it could potentially apply to anyone with a little shoehorning. Is a boy who doesn’t want to play sports as much as the other boys “transgender”, probably not, but with a little creativity a school councilor who feels like being “progressive” could probably make argue that he is.
I don’t really care if it is workable. I was just clarifying what the statistics you two were using applied to. You can also have statistics on people who believe that they are Jesus, regardless of whether that is workable.
That’s a perfectly workable definition, assuming you restrict to people who go around expressing this belief.