Black and white people have equal terminal moral values, but white people are instrumentally superior to black people, so white people should tend to dominate over black people, and we want to give white people more material comfort than black people so that white people associate with us more.
This position is often criticized as being a position of “white supremacy”, which is usually considered to be horrible racism. On a first glance, this criticism seems valid to me; it seems to fit the definition of white supremacy (“the belief that white people constitute a superior race and should therefore dominate society”), and it also seems to be the sort of thing a classical white nationalist would say and endorse as their ideology.
I think the main counterargument would be that this is a case of the noncentral fallacy. That is, we usually associate white supremacy with Jim Crow, the KKK, slavery, etc., or with laws that explicitly favor white people regardless of merit, whereas this position is compatible with rejecting such things.
However, I am not sure how solid the counterargument is. Maybe the issue is that the term “white supremacy” is badly named, but this position sure does seem to agree with classical white supremacists that it is desirable for white people to dominate society. (There’s some complications with asians and jews being higher IQ too, so that creates a distinction, but this distinction doesn’t seem central to why the position is considered bad.)
I think a primary distinction is one of legitimacy; classical white supremacy policies explicitly advantage whites in a way that makes it questionable whether whites truly are innately superior in the traits they claim to be, whereas the more mainstream white supremacy position wants to have at least a nominally even competition so that white people everywhere prove their superiority and that they deserve their power and wealth.
(There’s some complications with asians and jews being higher IQ too, so that creates a distinction, but this distinction doesn’t seem central to why the position is considered bad.)
That seems to make a large difference. Hearing that someone is a white supremacist would normally make us update toward this person being white and irrationally thinking their own race (which happens to be white) being superior. A form of selfish bias. But if we hear that a white (particularly gentile white) person thinks that Northeast Asian people have higher average IQs than whites, and Ashkenazi Jews having even higher average IQs, then we would strongly update against the conclusion above.
(In general, the discussion seems unduly distorted by the fact that the focus is almost always on black/white rather than on white/Northeast Asian, or the like. For example, when it is claimed that one group would feel hurt and excluded when such differences are pointed out. Personally I know not of a single white person who has complained about feeling hurt and excluded when hearing about data supporting higher average IQs for Asians or Jews. Maybe this would be different when living as a white minority in, say, Japan, but that seems still uncertain to me.)
Certain views are verboten to state and will, if stated, get you randomly attacked, especially by the crowd who’d look up 25 year old postings in the first place.
It does not matter what other things you do. It does not matter if you can be quoted as saying something that doesn’t put white people on the top.
“If only I had said it in a manner that makes it clear it’s not white supremacy, people wouldn’t hurt me” ignores that people don’t have rational discussion in mind. There is no way to say it in a manner that can’t be quoted out of context in social media and used to set a mob on you. You can’t avoid this by being nicer about it.
I think among white nationalists who believe that asians and jews are smarter, there is often a tendency to still prefer europeans, with the explicit justification given that asians are more conformist and therefore less innovative, and jews are more libertine and therefore prone to leftism/immigration-friendliness/gender progressivism.
Among the sort of techy contrarian people who might talk about IQ differences while rejecting and distancing themselves from white supremacy, I think there is often a preference for asians and jews. I guess it’s fair enough to say that this is not a selfish racial bias.
Also, regarding the position:
This position is often criticized as being a position of “white supremacy”, which is usually considered to be horrible racism. On a first glance, this criticism seems valid to me; it seems to fit the definition of white supremacy (“the belief that white people constitute a superior race and should therefore dominate society”), and it also seems to be the sort of thing a classical white nationalist would say and endorse as their ideology.
I think the main counterargument would be that this is a case of the noncentral fallacy. That is, we usually associate white supremacy with Jim Crow, the KKK, slavery, etc., or with laws that explicitly favor white people regardless of merit, whereas this position is compatible with rejecting such things.
However, I am not sure how solid the counterargument is. Maybe the issue is that the term “white supremacy” is badly named, but this position sure does seem to agree with classical white supremacists that it is desirable for white people to dominate society. (There’s some complications with asians and jews being higher IQ too, so that creates a distinction, but this distinction doesn’t seem central to why the position is considered bad.)
I think a primary distinction is one of legitimacy; classical white supremacy policies explicitly advantage whites in a way that makes it questionable whether whites truly are innately superior in the traits they claim to be, whereas the more mainstream white supremacy position wants to have at least a nominally even competition so that white people everywhere prove their superiority and that they deserve their power and wealth.
That seems to make a large difference. Hearing that someone is a white supremacist would normally make us update toward this person being white and irrationally thinking their own race (which happens to be white) being superior. A form of selfish bias. But if we hear that a white (particularly gentile white) person thinks that Northeast Asian people have higher average IQs than whites, and Ashkenazi Jews having even higher average IQs, then we would strongly update against the conclusion above.
(In general, the discussion seems unduly distorted by the fact that the focus is almost always on black/white rather than on white/Northeast Asian, or the like. For example, when it is claimed that one group would feel hurt and excluded when such differences are pointed out. Personally I know not of a single white person who has complained about feeling hurt and excluded when hearing about data supporting higher average IQs for Asians or Jews. Maybe this would be different when living as a white minority in, say, Japan, but that seems still uncertain to me.)
This seems to me like a quokka-like position.
Certain views are verboten to state and will, if stated, get you randomly attacked, especially by the crowd who’d look up 25 year old postings in the first place.
It does not matter what other things you do. It does not matter if you can be quoted as saying something that doesn’t put white people on the top.
“If only I had said it in a manner that makes it clear it’s not white supremacy, people wouldn’t hurt me” ignores that people don’t have rational discussion in mind. There is no way to say it in a manner that can’t be quoted out of context in social media and used to set a mob on you. You can’t avoid this by being nicer about it.
It’s also quokka-like in the opposite direction. Actual bona-fide white supremacists, like David Duke (founder of a revival of the KKK) will be indirect and evasive about their beliefs. If they can, they will totally try to get labelled not a white supremacist on some technicality.
I think among white nationalists who believe that asians and jews are smarter, there is often a tendency to still prefer europeans, with the explicit justification given that asians are more conformist and therefore less innovative, and jews are more libertine and therefore prone to leftism/immigration-friendliness/gender progressivism.
Among the sort of techy contrarian people who might talk about IQ differences while rejecting and distancing themselves from white supremacy, I think there is often a preference for asians and jews. I guess it’s fair enough to say that this is not a selfish racial bias.