Hmm. I don’t I want to commit to a huge discussion of it. I’m happy to continue doing async LW comments about it. I’m busier than usual this month. There might turn out to be a day I had a spare hour or two to chat in more detail but don’t think I want to spend cognition planning around that.
I think I’ve mostly said my main piece and am fairly happy with “LW members can read what Matt and Ray have said so far and vote accordingly.” If you raise specific points on specific posts I (and others) might change their vote for those posts.
Yeah so I think my thought on this is that it’s often impossible to point at these sorts of missing frames or implicit assumptions in a single post. In my review of Liron’s post I was able to pull out a bunch of quotes pointing to some specific frames, but that’s because it was unusually dense with examples.
In the case of this post, if I were to do the same thing, I think I’d have to pull out quotes from at least 3-4 of the posts in the sequence to point to this underlying straw man (in this case I didn’t actually do that and just sort of hoped others could do it own their own through reading my review).
That seems true, but I think it still makes sense to concentrate the discussion on particular posts. (Zack specifically disavowed this post and the meta-honesty response, so I think it makes most sense to concentrate on Where To Draw The Boundaries and Heads I Win, Tails Never Heard Of Her)
I think it’s reasonable to bring up “this post seems rooted in a wrong frame” on both of those, linking to other examples. But my own voting algorithm for those posts will personally be asking “does this single post have a high overall mix of ‘true’ and ‘important’?”
I think most posts in the review, even the top posts, have something wrong with them, and in some cases I disagree with the author about which things are wrong-enough-to-warrant-fixing. I do feel that the overall review process isn’t quite solid enough for me to really endorse the Best Of book as a statement of “The LessWrong Community fully endorses this post”, and I think that’s a major problem to be fixed for next year. But meanwhile I think it makes more sense to accept that some posts will have flaws.
Zack specifically disavowed this post and the meta-honesty response, so I think it makes most sense to concentrate on Where To Draw The Boundaries and Heads I Win, Tails Never Heard Of Her
Ahh, I didn’t realize that, definitely would not have reviewed this post if I realized this was the case.
But my own voting algorithm for those posts will personally be asking “does this single post have a high overall mix of ‘true’ and ‘important’?”
Yeah I think this is reasonable. I’m worried about thinks that are wrong is subtle non-obvious ways with certain frames or assumptions because it’s easy for those to sneak in under the radar of someone’s way of thinking, but I think it’s reasonable to not worry about that as well.
Want to doublecrux on this?
Hmm. I don’t I want to commit to a huge discussion of it. I’m happy to continue doing async LW comments about it. I’m busier than usual this month. There might turn out to be a day I had a spare hour or two to chat in more detail but don’t think I want to spend cognition planning around that.
I think I’ve mostly said my main piece and am fairly happy with “LW members can read what Matt and Ray have said so far and vote accordingly.” If you raise specific points on specific posts I (and others) might change their vote for those posts.
Yeah so I think my thought on this is that it’s often impossible to point at these sorts of missing frames or implicit assumptions in a single post. In my review of Liron’s post I was able to pull out a bunch of quotes pointing to some specific frames, but that’s because it was unusually dense with examples.
In the case of this post, if I were to do the same thing, I think I’d have to pull out quotes from at least 3-4 of the posts in the sequence to point to this underlying straw man (in this case I didn’t actually do that and just sort of hoped others could do it own their own through reading my review).
That seems true, but I think it still makes sense to concentrate the discussion on particular posts. (Zack specifically disavowed this post and the meta-honesty response, so I think it makes most sense to concentrate on Where To Draw The Boundaries and Heads I Win, Tails Never Heard Of Her)
I think it’s reasonable to bring up “this post seems rooted in a wrong frame” on both of those, linking to other examples. But my own voting algorithm for those posts will personally be asking “does this single post have a high overall mix of ‘true’ and ‘important’?”
I think most posts in the review, even the top posts, have something wrong with them, and in some cases I disagree with the author about which things are wrong-enough-to-warrant-fixing. I do feel that the overall review process isn’t quite solid enough for me to really endorse the Best Of book as a statement of “The LessWrong Community fully endorses this post”, and I think that’s a major problem to be fixed for next year. But meanwhile I think it makes more sense to accept that some posts will have flaws.
Ahh, I didn’t realize that, definitely would not have reviewed this post if I realized this was the case.
Yeah I think this is reasonable. I’m worried about thinks that are wrong is subtle non-obvious ways with certain frames or assumptions because it’s easy for those to sneak in under the radar of someone’s way of thinking, but I think it’s reasonable to not worry about that as well.