I see that you can read my mind and my votes. Glad you have that ability. Can you please provide evidence of what I am thinking and how I am voting? Thanks!
You can’t and you won’t. Your statements are patently false. I have in fact not consistently downvoted everyone who criticized me. I try to follow the general guidelines on voting. Please avoid making false statements in the future.
Anyway, not really interested in engaging in a conversation where you have vague accusations again, which are part of your general agenda against Intentional Insights, including making abusive/trollish claims, as you have previously explicitly acknowledged your intentions to be.
EDIT: Edited to include the link to the general guidelines on voting.
I see that you can read my mind and my votes. Glad you have that ability
It’s part of the Dark Arts package. I’ll dryly observe that I knew you downvoted him—how do you think I knew that you downvoted him? It’s not like downvotes come with names attached. Yes, I can “read your mind”, which is to say, I read the -massive- amounts of connotation information associated with otherwise bland text.
Can you please provide evidence of what I am thinking and how I am voting?
You, uh, admitted to it? “I thought his comments were not worth attention”
If it helps to know, extra downvotes your getting specifically in this thread, but not other ones, are coming from me. This comment isn’t meant as a glib statement to signal my affective disapproval. I just think this conversation is going nowhere, and think the quality of dialogue is getting worse. I’m downvoting these comments as I would others. I’m commenting so you know why I’m downvoting, and don’t cast aspersions at other users.
I can generally tell where downvotes are coming from. The aspersion I threw at Gleb is that he is, as far as I can tell, using sockpuppet accounts to upvote his own stuff (when he thinks it’s important). Complaining about my own downvotes would be petty and counterproductive. (Particularly since my total karma score remains unchanged from the beginning of this debacle. It was up 100 at one point, but dropped back down.)
I understand you use posturing and accusations without evidence as part of your Dark Arts arsenal, and accept that. I doubt anyone will come across this comment, since it’s so far down and the thread is not new. Just wanted you to know personally, in case you aren’t simply posturing, that I don’t use sockpuppets. I have a number of Less Wronger friends who support the cause of spreading rational thinking broadly, and whenever I make significant posts or particularly salient comments, I let them know, so that they can give me optimizing suggestions and feedback.
Since they happen to share many of my views, they sometimes upvote my comments. They generally don’t participate actively, and this is a rare exception on the part of Raelifin, as they do not want to be caught in the backlash. So FYI for the future. Feel free to continue making these accusations for Dark Arts purposes if you wish, but I just wanted you to know.
The term for extreme versions of this is “meatpuppet”. Of course having friends is not the same thing as having meatpuppets, and I have no way of knowing to what extent your friends are LW participants who just happen to be your friends and would have upvoted your articles anyway, and to what extent they’re people who come here only to upvote your articles for you. The nearer the latter, the more meatpuppety.
Well, didn’t expect other people besides myself and OrphanWilde to still be reading this thread, updating on that.
The people who I’m talking about are LW participants, I wouldn’t ask them to give me feedback and advice on my writing and engagement otherwise, what’s the point of doing so? To be clear, far from all of them upvote my comments, as they don’t agree with everything I write, of course. And my point in bringing their attention to it is for me to improve my communication, and also help myself update. It’s harder to update when things are said in a hostile way by faceless LW commenters, but my friends can provide me with a trusted external perspective on things. They do tend to agree with most stuff, sometimes choose to upvote, and rarely comment, for the reasons stated above.
I’m sharing all of this for the sake of transparency, as this is a strong value I hold. Not something I had to share, and I know it arouses suspicions, but this is my choice due to my personal value system.
You have consistently downvoted everyone who criticized you
I have specific evidence that I actually upvoted some people who made statements not friendly to me when I thought they made good points worthy of public consideration. Please avoid lying in the future. It really harms your reputation.
I don’t have a reputation to protect, or at least not a terribly positive one (indeed, I dislike having a positive reputation, because it makes it costly to abandon it). I do believe I previously advised you on the benefits and drawbacks of that.
And now I see someone went through and downvoted all of my previous posts and comments. I suppose it wasn’t you, because your mastery of Dark Arts would enable you to find more creative ways of harming InIn and me.
Or who knows, maybe it was you. Hard to tell at this point. Not very familiar at all with these sorts of underhanded strategies and mind games and deliberate efforts to attack my reputation on Less Wrong, as you clearly describe here is your intention.
Or who knows, maybe it was you. Hard to tell at this point. Not very familiar at all with these sorts of underhanded strategies and mind games and deliberate efforts to attack my reputation on Less Wrong, as you clearly describe here is your intention.
This paragraph feels passive-aggressive to me. If you think you got mass downvoted tell Nancy and she can ask Trike Apps for the perpetrator.
You realize that when you edit your comments, an asterisk shows up? Because I tire of your rather boring and predictable approach to Dark Arts, I’ll go ahead and head this one off: I didn’t downvote all of your previous posts and comments, I downvoted those here, in this post, where you were spamming. Additionally, a lazy look through your profile turns up several posts and comments which, quite definitively, were not downvoted. If your upvotes have taken a shock, it’s because of your behavior, not a downvote bot.
http://lesswrong.com/lw/mvw/improving_the_effectiveness_of_effective_altruism/ for one example of a non-downvoted post from the first page of your posts. Given your rather blatant use of sockpuppets (or people from your organization told to upvote your posts/comments, which is the same thing as far as I’m concerned) for manipulating voting, the fact that it may get downvoted after I post this should not be taken as evidence by the audience of anything.
How do I know you’re using sockpuppets or human analogues? Because your upvotes are consistent across a given timeframe without regard to comment quality. Which is also why you noticed the fact that some of your 4-upvote comments were downvoted, because you worked to get them to 4.
ETA: See the asterisk?
Also, any administrators are welcome to check my upvote/downvote history. If necessary I’ll provide my password to an administrator to verify. (I’m not worried about being locked out of my account, because I can easily accumulate more upvotes, and anybody who dislikes me enough to want to do that probably wouldn’t desire me to lose my heard-earned reputation for being an annoying blowhard.)
Glad to see that whoever downvoted my previous submissions and comments happened to miss one, nice to know that. However, when my karma suddenly starts going down rapidly and goes down by a 100+ points, it generally indicates a downvoting wave.
Yup, I know that an asterisk shows up when I make edits. Thus, when I make any major edits, or when someone already responded to my comment, I add an EDIT note to them. When I make minor adjustments for grammar/spelling/phrasing, and when someone did not yet respond to my comment, I do not.
I did downvote some of them, but not, as a rule, those which engendered or contributed to the conversation.
And you apparently don’t understand what I was “clearly” describing there, so allow me to be clear: I used an openly hostile attack because it meant the weight of evidence was on -your- side. All you had to do to have no damage to your reputation was to say nothing at all, and my tirade would have been taken as unfair and hostile. Instead, you doubled down on exactly the wrong behaviors.
Ah, another lie from you combined with a masterful use of Dark Arts. You state here that:
I used an openly hostile attack because it meant the weight of evidence was on -your- side
However, in your previous comments, you clearly acknowledged that you used an openly hostile attack because it meant that the weight of evidence would be on the side of the person making the attack—you. Indeed, using an openly hostile attack anchors the “weight of public opinion” in your own words, on the side of the one making the attack. It primes the reader to agree, as we intuitively emotionally agree with the things we first come across, and have to use System 2 to force ourselves to disagree. So please avoid lying in the future. You’re really not doing yourself any favors by your blatant lies.
No, you were angry that he was criticizing you. You have consistently downvoted everyone who criticized you.
I see that you can read my mind and my votes. Glad you have that ability. Can you please provide evidence of what I am thinking and how I am voting? Thanks!
You can’t and you won’t. Your statements are patently false. I have in fact not consistently downvoted everyone who criticized me. I try to follow the general guidelines on voting. Please avoid making false statements in the future.
Anyway, not really interested in engaging in a conversation where you have vague accusations again, which are part of your general agenda against Intentional Insights, including making abusive/trollish claims, as you have previously explicitly acknowledged your intentions to be.
EDIT: Edited to include the link to the general guidelines on voting.
It’s part of the Dark Arts package. I’ll dryly observe that I knew you downvoted him—how do you think I knew that you downvoted him? It’s not like downvotes come with names attached. Yes, I can “read your mind”, which is to say, I read the -massive- amounts of connotation information associated with otherwise bland text.
You, uh, admitted to it? “I thought his comments were not worth attention”
If it helps to know, extra downvotes your getting specifically in this thread, but not other ones, are coming from me. This comment isn’t meant as a glib statement to signal my affective disapproval. I just think this conversation is going nowhere, and think the quality of dialogue is getting worse. I’m downvoting these comments as I would others. I’m commenting so you know why I’m downvoting, and don’t cast aspersions at other users.
Thanks for letting me know!
I can generally tell where downvotes are coming from. The aspersion I threw at Gleb is that he is, as far as I can tell, using sockpuppet accounts to upvote his own stuff (when he thinks it’s important). Complaining about my own downvotes would be petty and counterproductive. (Particularly since my total karma score remains unchanged from the beginning of this debacle. It was up 100 at one point, but dropped back down.)
I understand you use posturing and accusations without evidence as part of your Dark Arts arsenal, and accept that. I doubt anyone will come across this comment, since it’s so far down and the thread is not new. Just wanted you to know personally, in case you aren’t simply posturing, that I don’t use sockpuppets. I have a number of Less Wronger friends who support the cause of spreading rational thinking broadly, and whenever I make significant posts or particularly salient comments, I let them know, so that they can give me optimizing suggestions and feedback.
Since they happen to share many of my views, they sometimes upvote my comments. They generally don’t participate actively, and this is a rare exception on the part of Raelifin, as they do not want to be caught in the backlash. So FYI for the future. Feel free to continue making these accusations for Dark Arts purposes if you wish, but I just wanted you to know.
The term for extreme versions of this is “meatpuppet”. Of course having friends is not the same thing as having meatpuppets, and I have no way of knowing to what extent your friends are LW participants who just happen to be your friends and would have upvoted your articles anyway, and to what extent they’re people who come here only to upvote your articles for you. The nearer the latter, the more meatpuppety.
Well, didn’t expect other people besides myself and OrphanWilde to still be reading this thread, updating on that.
The people who I’m talking about are LW participants, I wouldn’t ask them to give me feedback and advice on my writing and engagement otherwise, what’s the point of doing so? To be clear, far from all of them upvote my comments, as they don’t agree with everything I write, of course. And my point in bringing their attention to it is for me to improve my communication, and also help myself update. It’s harder to update when things are said in a hostile way by faceless LW commenters, but my friends can provide me with a trusted external perspective on things. They do tend to agree with most stuff, sometimes choose to upvote, and rarely comment, for the reasons stated above.
I’m sharing all of this for the sake of transparency, as this is a strong value I hold. Not something I had to share, and I know it arouses suspicions, but this is my choice due to my personal value system.
LOL. So no sockpuppets but a cheerleading squad on call..? X-)
I responded about this above.
As I stated above, I am committed to transparency and openness, which is why I acknowledged downvoting the comments from Vaniver.
Your lie was the following:
I have specific evidence that I actually upvoted some people who made statements not friendly to me when I thought they made good points worthy of public consideration. Please avoid lying in the future. It really harms your reputation.
I don’t have a reputation to protect, or at least not a terribly positive one (indeed, I dislike having a positive reputation, because it makes it costly to abandon it). I do believe I previously advised you on the benefits and drawbacks of that.
And now I see someone went through and downvoted all of my previous posts and comments. I suppose it wasn’t you, because your mastery of Dark Arts would enable you to find more creative ways of harming InIn and me.
Or who knows, maybe it was you. Hard to tell at this point. Not very familiar at all with these sorts of underhanded strategies and mind games and deliberate efforts to attack my reputation on Less Wrong, as you clearly describe here is your intention.
This paragraph feels passive-aggressive to me. If you think you got mass downvoted tell Nancy and she can ask Trike Apps for the perpetrator.
Oh, thanks for letting me know about this option, appreciate it!
I wrote that last part when I was in a state of frustration due to the downvoting, so I wasn’t being as conscious about my writing as I usually am.
You realize that when you edit your comments, an asterisk shows up? Because I tire of your rather boring and predictable approach to Dark Arts, I’ll go ahead and head this one off: I didn’t downvote all of your previous posts and comments, I downvoted those here, in this post, where you were spamming. Additionally, a lazy look through your profile turns up several posts and comments which, quite definitively, were not downvoted. If your upvotes have taken a shock, it’s because of your behavior, not a downvote bot.
http://lesswrong.com/lw/mvw/improving_the_effectiveness_of_effective_altruism/ for one example of a non-downvoted post from the first page of your posts. Given your rather blatant use of sockpuppets (or people from your organization told to upvote your posts/comments, which is the same thing as far as I’m concerned) for manipulating voting, the fact that it may get downvoted after I post this should not be taken as evidence by the audience of anything.
How do I know you’re using sockpuppets or human analogues? Because your upvotes are consistent across a given timeframe without regard to comment quality. Which is also why you noticed the fact that some of your 4-upvote comments were downvoted, because you worked to get them to 4.
ETA: See the asterisk?
Also, any administrators are welcome to check my upvote/downvote history. If necessary I’ll provide my password to an administrator to verify. (I’m not worried about being locked out of my account, because I can easily accumulate more upvotes, and anybody who dislikes me enough to want to do that probably wouldn’t desire me to lose my heard-earned reputation for being an annoying blowhard.)
In cases like that, cite the post you are replying to.
Glad to see that whoever downvoted my previous submissions and comments happened to miss one, nice to know that. However, when my karma suddenly starts going down rapidly and goes down by a 100+ points, it generally indicates a downvoting wave.
Yup, I know that an asterisk shows up when I make edits. Thus, when I make any major edits, or when someone already responded to my comment, I add an EDIT note to them. When I make minor adjustments for grammar/spelling/phrasing, and when someone did not yet respond to my comment, I do not.
Really.
I did downvote some of them, but not, as a rule, those which engendered or contributed to the conversation.
And you apparently don’t understand what I was “clearly” describing there, so allow me to be clear: I used an openly hostile attack because it meant the weight of evidence was on -your- side. All you had to do to have no damage to your reputation was to say nothing at all, and my tirade would have been taken as unfair and hostile. Instead, you doubled down on exactly the wrong behaviors.
Ah, another lie from you combined with a masterful use of Dark Arts. You state here that:
However, in your previous comments, you clearly acknowledged that you used an openly hostile attack because it meant that the weight of evidence would be on the side of the person making the attack—you. Indeed, using an openly hostile attack anchors the “weight of public opinion” in your own words, on the side of the one making the attack. It primes the reader to agree, as we intuitively emotionally agree with the things we first come across, and have to use System 2 to force ourselves to disagree. So please avoid lying in the future. You’re really not doing yourself any favors by your blatant lies.