Those attempting to ignore fashion might say “function over form”, yet the form of clothes have quite a bit of function: social affiliation, likeability, attractiveness, and other important aspects of dealing with humans are directly affected by fashion. My recent research on the topic suggests that it’s a highly specialized field, requiring a great deal of continuing research and effort to understand in depth.
The issues of concern are:
Fit. How well does the item conform to your body shape? This is critically important and yet very difficult to assess in a quantifiable or repeatable way, and is therefore the area where an expert would make the most difference. Of note, tailoring an existing item can be very cheap, as little as $5 to $15 for shirt alterations (of course there are many that charge more), with much to learn from the tailor’s advice.
Quality / Cost. The fabric used, the location and process of manufacture, the conformity to accepted standards, and the dollar cost. Most purchases by the fashion conscious are done using sales, and the “retail price” is the sucker price. (“Nobody pays retail.”) Bespoke (custom, or personally made for you) items are generally at the top, though also high cost.
Currency. A “modern” fit, meaning conformity to current style decisions regarding lengths, widths, color matching, and type matching. (Note that there are several mentions of conforming, and none of comfort.) Individual items are often referred to as S/S 11 (Spring/Summer 2011) or F/W 10 (Fall/Winter 2010), indicating a two season per year refresh rate on the exact meaning of “modern”. This is the primary reason it requires continuing research; avoiding this and remaining stylish requires use of “classics”.
Details. Once the basics are covered, the details make a big difference. The lining, the hint of different colors, patterns vs. solids, vents, hems, etc. This is often the accepted place to show individuality.
Patina. Items straight out of a box are good for being generally impressive and showing a pristine appearance, but often the ‘life’ of an item comes through after many uses, shown as scuffs, fades, wrinkles, even stains or rips, telling a story about that item and its owner. Patina is why ripped jeans can be stylish.
There are many very specific rules which fall outside of this, such as which colors, patterns, or styles to wear for which occasions (‘business casual’, ‘law firm’, ‘weekend’, ‘prom’, ‘street’). They’re too many to easily enumerate, culturally specific, and I haven’t yet found a place which tries to lay out “consolidated wisdom”.
Stores are ranked by their ability to produce the cheapest clothing with the highest rating—good fits out of the box using quality materials at sale prices. Many fashion followers have “grail” items, things which are out of their price range, but they wish to acquire. They also tend to have extensive collections for mixing and matching: closets full of shoes or 8 sweaters that are barely different, showing signs of potential hoarding and materialism. It’s easy for many such people to spend thousands of dollars on a single item, such as a pair of boots or a handbag.
Fashion is dangerous territory for anyone with a desire to min / max; it’s subject to threshold effects, constant change, and diversification requirements. There’s normally a large gap between ‘basic quality’ items you can buy at mall stores and ‘good quality’ items from luxury stores. For example, there’s many basic quality leather or canvas handbags in the $40 to $150 range, but to go up a tier, you’d have to hit $1000 or more; pretty much everything in the $150 to $1000 range is of $40 to $150 quality. Bargain hunting, used by true fashion followers to acquire such items, requires significant time and effort. Which names are worth the money also changes over time, with some switching from top quality to using flimsy leather, third-world workers and mechanical stitching, or YKK instead of RiRi zippers, without letting anyone know, requiring individual inspection.
To get back on the topic of signalling, clothes rank third behind grooming and body type when discussing personal appearance. Getting a nice haircut, being cleanly, smelling good, exercising, and controlling your diet make more difference, and cost much less in dollar terms, though they take much more time. This fits with a signalling theory that primary signals are related to difficult-to-fake costs: how much time you’ve put in to look the way you do, with dollars (purchased items) being a proxy, easier to fake, allowing patina to add value.
With clothing, the rules are more often broken or ignored, especially for many areas outside of large population centers—people simply dress like those around them, with what their parents style them as, or with what they have access to in the immediate area. It’s often stated on the fashion forums I’ve lurked for months now: “98 percent of people don’t care about this stuff and won’t notice the difference.”
Conforming to the basics seems like a much easier goal.
To point out the obvious, the point at which you’re worrying about “currency” is too far beyond the point of diminishing marginal returns for most LW folk.
“98 percent of people don’t care about this stuff and won’t notice the difference.”
This is referring to the difference between $40-150 per article and $1000+ per article when holding “fit” roughly constant, correct? (It’s not quite obvious from context.)
In-the-field testing from members of fashion forums show that people on the street are generally unable to identify quality from sight alone, hence the propensity of some labels to provide very large and garish branding. Appropriately, those who I quoted attempt to find articles of better quality without a visible brand name, since symbols like that ruin much of the effect. It also provides a higher barrier to entry, though conforming too closely to community norms can get you labeled “dressed by the internet”.
Many of the $1000 items are purchased at much lower prices due to losing “currency” yet still meeting the other attributes. Access to deep discounts like this is only available in-store in major cities (NYC, LA). Ebay is also frequented, along with foreign shops, though with heavy analysis for fakes and by using trust networks and proxy buyers.
Also note that the currency effect happens even for the most common brands—they’re following the luxury designers, perhaps behind by a season or two. Why did they have that really nice shirt at J.C Penny last month, but now you can’t find it? They don’t make it any more, because it was St. John’s Bay S/S 10. Check the clearance racks and stick to the classics.
Please consider writing up a (discussion) post on your experiences. It sounds fascinating. I personally would be particularly interested in changes in how the less fashion conscious reacted to you.
To quickly answer that, people definitely noticed when I started dressing better, and I received many positive remarks and a few negative.
Some of the more telling comments:
A friend: “Nice shirt… you know, I try not to judge, and that’s why I hung out with you, but you’re really looking better after your fashion project.” To me, this hints that I was being judged (for years?) by this person, even though they’re my friend.
A family member: “Those are really nice boots, where can I get those? They’re almost work boots… though far too nice to be wearing out here in the woods! And those jeans.. be careful, that shade of denim can bleed onto white shirts like that, trust me, I know all about fabric.” This is from my Aunt, who creates many bespoke shirts for her family, and has worked in craft stores for decades. Tellingly, it was just Levi’s and Doc Martens (both classics), with the proper colors and fit.
My boss: “You know, when I first I saw you, I thought to myself, ‘I hired that?!’ But you really cleaned up well.” I had a phone interview for the position. This says to me it’s very likely I would not have been hired due to looks alone, but that I had improved to hireability, allowing them to justify the action.
My brother asked me for advice, though he realized my ‘transferred wisdom’ method of learning, and asked ‘How would your fashion forum people judge this look?’ instead of asking for my personal judgment.
A negative remark I received was that I seemed to be dressing more like a person in a TV show, with the suggestion that I was exceeding my current reference class and conforming too much with the popular view.
Those attempting to ignore fashion might say “function over form”, yet the form of clothes have quite a bit of function: social affiliation, likeability, attractiveness, and other important aspects of dealing with humans are directly affected by fashion. My recent research on the topic suggests that it’s a highly specialized field, requiring a great deal of continuing research and effort to understand in depth.
The issues of concern are:
Fit. How well does the item conform to your body shape? This is critically important and yet very difficult to assess in a quantifiable or repeatable way, and is therefore the area where an expert would make the most difference. Of note, tailoring an existing item can be very cheap, as little as $5 to $15 for shirt alterations (of course there are many that charge more), with much to learn from the tailor’s advice.
Quality / Cost. The fabric used, the location and process of manufacture, the conformity to accepted standards, and the dollar cost. Most purchases by the fashion conscious are done using sales, and the “retail price” is the sucker price. (“Nobody pays retail.”) Bespoke (custom, or personally made for you) items are generally at the top, though also high cost.
Currency. A “modern” fit, meaning conformity to current style decisions regarding lengths, widths, color matching, and type matching. (Note that there are several mentions of conforming, and none of comfort.) Individual items are often referred to as S/S 11 (Spring/Summer 2011) or F/W 10 (Fall/Winter 2010), indicating a two season per year refresh rate on the exact meaning of “modern”. This is the primary reason it requires continuing research; avoiding this and remaining stylish requires use of “classics”.
Details. Once the basics are covered, the details make a big difference. The lining, the hint of different colors, patterns vs. solids, vents, hems, etc. This is often the accepted place to show individuality.
Patina. Items straight out of a box are good for being generally impressive and showing a pristine appearance, but often the ‘life’ of an item comes through after many uses, shown as scuffs, fades, wrinkles, even stains or rips, telling a story about that item and its owner. Patina is why ripped jeans can be stylish.
There are many very specific rules which fall outside of this, such as which colors, patterns, or styles to wear for which occasions (‘business casual’, ‘law firm’, ‘weekend’, ‘prom’, ‘street’). They’re too many to easily enumerate, culturally specific, and I haven’t yet found a place which tries to lay out “consolidated wisdom”.
Stores are ranked by their ability to produce the cheapest clothing with the highest rating—good fits out of the box using quality materials at sale prices. Many fashion followers have “grail” items, things which are out of their price range, but they wish to acquire. They also tend to have extensive collections for mixing and matching: closets full of shoes or 8 sweaters that are barely different, showing signs of potential hoarding and materialism. It’s easy for many such people to spend thousands of dollars on a single item, such as a pair of boots or a handbag.
Fashion is dangerous territory for anyone with a desire to min / max; it’s subject to threshold effects, constant change, and diversification requirements. There’s normally a large gap between ‘basic quality’ items you can buy at mall stores and ‘good quality’ items from luxury stores. For example, there’s many basic quality leather or canvas handbags in the $40 to $150 range, but to go up a tier, you’d have to hit $1000 or more; pretty much everything in the $150 to $1000 range is of $40 to $150 quality. Bargain hunting, used by true fashion followers to acquire such items, requires significant time and effort. Which names are worth the money also changes over time, with some switching from top quality to using flimsy leather, third-world workers and mechanical stitching, or YKK instead of RiRi zippers, without letting anyone know, requiring individual inspection.
To get back on the topic of signalling, clothes rank third behind grooming and body type when discussing personal appearance. Getting a nice haircut, being cleanly, smelling good, exercising, and controlling your diet make more difference, and cost much less in dollar terms, though they take much more time. This fits with a signalling theory that primary signals are related to difficult-to-fake costs: how much time you’ve put in to look the way you do, with dollars (purchased items) being a proxy, easier to fake, allowing patina to add value.
With clothing, the rules are more often broken or ignored, especially for many areas outside of large population centers—people simply dress like those around them, with what their parents style them as, or with what they have access to in the immediate area. It’s often stated on the fashion forums I’ve lurked for months now: “98 percent of people don’t care about this stuff and won’t notice the difference.”
Conforming to the basics seems like a much easier goal.
To point out the obvious, the point at which you’re worrying about “currency” is too far beyond the point of diminishing marginal returns for most LW folk.
This is referring to the difference between $40-150 per article and $1000+ per article when holding “fit” roughly constant, correct? (It’s not quite obvious from context.)
Yes, fit is paramount, details are secondary.
In-the-field testing from members of fashion forums show that people on the street are generally unable to identify quality from sight alone, hence the propensity of some labels to provide very large and garish branding. Appropriately, those who I quoted attempt to find articles of better quality without a visible brand name, since symbols like that ruin much of the effect. It also provides a higher barrier to entry, though conforming too closely to community norms can get you labeled “dressed by the internet”.
Many of the $1000 items are purchased at much lower prices due to losing “currency” yet still meeting the other attributes. Access to deep discounts like this is only available in-store in major cities (NYC, LA). Ebay is also frequented, along with foreign shops, though with heavy analysis for fakes and by using trust networks and proxy buyers.
Also note that the currency effect happens even for the most common brands—they’re following the luxury designers, perhaps behind by a season or two. Why did they have that really nice shirt at J.C Penny last month, but now you can’t find it? They don’t make it any more, because it was St. John’s Bay S/S 10. Check the clearance racks and stick to the classics.
Please consider writing up a (discussion) post on your experiences. It sounds fascinating. I personally would be particularly interested in changes in how the less fashion conscious reacted to you.
To quickly answer that, people definitely noticed when I started dressing better, and I received many positive remarks and a few negative.
Some of the more telling comments:
A friend: “Nice shirt… you know, I try not to judge, and that’s why I hung out with you, but you’re really looking better after your fashion project.” To me, this hints that I was being judged (for years?) by this person, even though they’re my friend.
A family member: “Those are really nice boots, where can I get those? They’re almost work boots… though far too nice to be wearing out here in the woods! And those jeans.. be careful, that shade of denim can bleed onto white shirts like that, trust me, I know all about fabric.” This is from my Aunt, who creates many bespoke shirts for her family, and has worked in craft stores for decades. Tellingly, it was just Levi’s and Doc Martens (both classics), with the proper colors and fit.
My boss: “You know, when I first I saw you, I thought to myself, ‘I hired that?!’ But you really cleaned up well.” I had a phone interview for the position. This says to me it’s very likely I would not have been hired due to looks alone, but that I had improved to hireability, allowing them to justify the action.
My brother asked me for advice, though he realized my ‘transferred wisdom’ method of learning, and asked ‘How would your fashion forum people judge this look?’ instead of asking for my personal judgment.
A negative remark I received was that I seemed to be dressing more like a person in a TV show, with the suggestion that I was exceeding my current reference class and conforming too much with the popular view.
What fashion forums have you used?
styleforum.net primarily (male focus), and many sites linked from there.
Thanks :)
I would really really like to see a discussion/top level post about your experience and advice on this topic.
Agree.