I’m not sure about how I feel about Eliezer’s approach on religion in the sequences. On the one hand, I like using sarcasm; on the other, that doesn’t seem to work for more deeply-rooted beliefs, like religion. I think he should’ve left religion out of his sequences on rationality and criticized it later. The way he did it, it may scare off people who still have a somewhat deep link to religion, before they can learn enough to be able to break free.
On the third hand, I think I may be biased towards avoiding conflicts.
On the specific point illustrated by the story, as expressed in the quote at the beginning of the post, I do agree. I try to induce that same feeling of “shock from how stupid people can be” when I notice a mistake I’ve done, as some kind of mini-”Crisis of Faith”.
What makes this one in particular “really bad” is that if “Mary was a lying adulterer” was the most likely explanation for the story of the virgin birth, this could be justified on the grounds of pointing out an uncomfortable truth. But, given the timeline of accounts, the actual most likely explanation is that the whole virgin birth story was made up several decades after the supposed date of the Crucifixion as a soldier argument for “Jesus was special”, and nobody on the “Jesus was special” side was willing to attack it.
So, instead of a powerful example of how “arguments are soldiers” turned a ridiculous idea into a dogma of both Christianity and Islam, we got a minor rewrite of the story of the Toledot Yeshu, with a rabbi replacing a Roman soldier as the lying Mary’s adulterous lover. Because the original Toledot Yeshu was apparently such a breakthrough in rationality-promotion.
I think the Master Plan is to mostly leave religion out of the books he’s writing instead, or at least out of one of them. Anyone else remember reading something along these lines?
I’m not sure about how I feel about Eliezer’s approach on religion in the sequences. On the one hand, I like using sarcasm; on the other, that doesn’t seem to work for more deeply-rooted beliefs, like religion. I think he should’ve left religion out of his sequences on rationality and criticized it later. The way he did it, it may scare off people who still have a somewhat deep link to religion, before they can learn enough to be able to break free.
On the third hand, I think I may be biased towards avoiding conflicts.
On the specific point illustrated by the story, as expressed in the quote at the beginning of the post, I do agree. I try to induce that same feeling of “shock from how stupid people can be” when I notice a mistake I’ve done, as some kind of mini-”Crisis of Faith”.
Eliezer makes the same point at If Many-Worlds Had Come First.
I don’t think he should have left religion out entirely. It’s both the elephant in the room for many topics, and also an interesting example.
This post specifically, on the other hand, was pretty bad.
What makes this one in particular “really bad” is that if “Mary was a lying adulterer” was the most likely explanation for the story of the virgin birth, this could be justified on the grounds of pointing out an uncomfortable truth. But, given the timeline of accounts, the actual most likely explanation is that the whole virgin birth story was made up several decades after the supposed date of the Crucifixion as a soldier argument for “Jesus was special”, and nobody on the “Jesus was special” side was willing to attack it.
So, instead of a powerful example of how “arguments are soldiers” turned a ridiculous idea into a dogma of both Christianity and Islam, we got a minor rewrite of the story of the Toledot Yeshu, with a rabbi replacing a Roman soldier as the lying Mary’s adulterous lover. Because the original Toledot Yeshu was apparently such a breakthrough in rationality-promotion.
More or less my thoughts.
I think the Master Plan is to mostly leave religion out of the books he’s writing instead, or at least out of one of them. Anyone else remember reading something along these lines?
Indeed