Harry hisses “You have missinterpreted prophecy, to your great peril, becausse of power I have, but you know not. Yess, you are sstudying sscience, but, honesstly, you are yearss behind me. It may be that thiss power you know not iss ssomething I have at thiss sspecific time, that you will not know for too many yearss hence.
Before I explain, remember my Vow, and know my honesst intention not to desstroy the world, Vow or no. Now, do you know why I would tear apart the very sstarss? Do you know how? Not to desstroy the world, but to ssave it from whatever threatss require more energy to extinguissh than exisstss in thiss entire ssolar ssystem. There are more thingss in heaven and earth, Dark Lord, than are dreamt of in your philossophy.
I would usse sstar lifting to do it ssafely. In a way, I really would end the world to ssave it, ssince once humanss are out of the cradle, sspread through… er, let uss ssay ‘heaven’ in Parsseltongue, to mean well beyond thiss planet, why not add the masss of the Earth itsself to the sstuff of the sstarss, to yield that much more energy? And sso, if you avert thiss prophecy, there iss sseriouss rissk you doom yoursself! Are you willing to take that chance?
And why were you the one to hear thiss prophecy, Dark Lord? Why are you the one to causse it or avert it? What iss your abssolute advantage? Not in killing. Killing is eassy. Thiss iss your blind sspot cossting you much more in expected value than lasst time if you do not lissten.
You are the one becausse you have come clossesst by far, ass far ass I know, to true immortality, though thiss project iss not yet complete, elsse prophecy would not concern you to degree it obvioussly doess. Usseful sstar lifting will take time; much more than ussual lifesspan.
Ssupposse you heard thiss prophecy becausse you are to sshare thiss advantage with me, and together we will tear apart the very sstarss in ‘heaven’ to prevent ssomething actually bad! Ssomething we both may know nothing of yet, though I already have guesssess; and you know thiss project iss likely to go fasster with me than without me. Your lack of complete immortality meanss time may not be on your sside.
All I have ssaid iss my honesst besst esstimate. If you do not trusst my viewss, let uss wake girl-child friend, ass sshe alsso knowss more of sscience than you. No offence. And becausse I have told you of sstar lifting, that you clearly knew not of, at thiss time when it matterss mosst—conssider the sserioussnesss of your error if I had tried esscaping—you will protect and honor deputy sschoolmissstresss, with the undersstanding that your reign hass already begun. Now what iss the resst of the prophecy?”
Harry puts it together mainly from clues in the three most recent chapters and Chapter 86.
Edited to add: if you’re reading this, Eliezer, please see this comment below for the Appendix.
Sure. Along with the centaur evidence, there’s: Harry’s thought on star lifting in response to this prophecy in Ch. 21, Harry noticing Quirrelmort’s interest in the same prophecy in Ch. 86, Quirrelmort’s talk of the stars’ vulnerability to “sufficiently intelligent idiocy” in Ch. 95, Voldemort’s “while the stars yet live” remark in Ch. 111, Voldemort’s more explicit talk on the prophecy and his great fear of it in the next chapter, and how the Unbreakable Vow is framed in the most recent chapter. If Harry connects these dots, he’ll have a good idea of what the full prophecy says.
Although it sounds persuasive to us, to Voldemort this would sound like exactly the sort of ‘intelligent idiocy’ that would only solidify his belief that Harry has to be killed right away.
Voldemort would be skeptical, yes, but he would also be interested, because “6. It is impossible to tell lies in Parseltongue” and because all this speech has to do is raise the risk enough that it makes more sense to stop and gather more information before killing Harry, thus it “allow[s] Harry to evade immediate death”. What do you think would improve the believability?
As a move that Harry can devise, this requires a description of the thinking that makes it possible. He’s not told the full prophecy and doesn’t know which prophecy Voldemort is talking about. I didn’t realize he could piece it together sufficiently, but in Ch. 21 he hears the beginning of the first prophecy (THE ONE WHO WILL TEAR APART THE VERY S...); in Ch. 86 Quirrell discusses it with him, pointing out that Harry or Quirrel are likely ones with the power to enact or prevent the event that the prophecy is concerned with; and in Ch. 101 the centaur implies that there is a prediction that “soon the skies will be empty” with Harry responsible yet somehow “innocent” in an unclear sense.
Your point on a description of Harry’s thinking is well-taken. I just had my brother submit this as a review, to err on the side of caution:
“With NickRoy’s permission, I am submitting his solution, which I agree with, with additional evidence appended, just in case that is necessary; so consider this as superseding NickRoy’s submission:
[the relevant text is here in the submission, but I don’t need to repeat it in this comment]
Appended:
Harry does not know the full prophecy for certain, but he can guess it, based on: Harry’s thought on star lifting in response to this prophecy in Ch. 21, Harry noticing Quirrelmort’s interest in the same prophecy in Ch. 86, Quirrelmort’s talk of the stars’ vulnerability to “sufficiently intelligent idiocy” in Ch. 95, Firenze’s comment on the stars and Harry’s innocence in Ch. 101, Voldemort’s “while the stars yet live” remark in Ch. 111, Voldemort’s more explicit talk on the prophecy and his great fear of it in the next chapter, and how the Unbreakable Vow is framed in the most recent chapter. If Harry connects these dots, he’ll have a good idea of what the full prophecy says.
As for how Harry connects these dots: he runs with the hypothesis (quickly, as he did in Ch. 104): “I am to destroy the world [I don’t have to explain why this idea stands out to him] in some way that is not actually bad”, since if he were to destroy the world in a way that really is bad, but this may be preventable, he probably should die immediately instead! My first thought on this line of thinking (since “Harry is allowed to solve this problem the way I would solve it”) is: “well, someday Earth ought to be converted into computronium for hedonium purposes, though the Sun is much more massive, and then we have the nearby stars… Oh”.
Also, on Voldemort’s response: Voldemort would be skeptical, but he would also be interested, because “It is impossible to tell lies in Parseltongue” and because all this persuasion has to do is raise the risk enough that it makes more sense to stop and gather more information before killing Harry, thus it “allows Harry to evade immediate death”.”
Harry hisses “You have missinterpreted prophecy, to your great peril, becausse of power I have, but you know not. Yess, you are sstudying sscience, but, honesstly, you are yearss behind me. It may be that thiss power you know not iss ssomething I have at thiss sspecific time, that you will not know for too many yearss hence.
Before I explain, remember my Vow, and know my honesst intention not to desstroy the world, Vow or no. Now, do you know why I would tear apart the very sstarss? Do you know how? Not to desstroy the world, but to ssave it from whatever threatss require more energy to extinguissh than exisstss in thiss entire ssolar ssystem. There are more thingss in heaven and earth, Dark Lord, than are dreamt of in your philossophy.
I would usse sstar lifting to do it ssafely. In a way, I really would end the world to ssave it, ssince once humanss are out of the cradle, sspread through… er, let uss ssay ‘heaven’ in Parsseltongue, to mean well beyond thiss planet, why not add the masss of the Earth itsself to the sstuff of the sstarss, to yield that much more energy? And sso, if you avert thiss prophecy, there iss sseriouss rissk you doom yoursself! Are you willing to take that chance?
And why were you the one to hear thiss prophecy, Dark Lord? Why are you the one to causse it or avert it? What iss your abssolute advantage? Not in killing. Killing is eassy. Thiss iss your blind sspot cossting you much more in expected value than lasst time if you do not lissten.
You are the one becausse you have come clossesst by far, ass far ass I know, to true immortality, though thiss project iss not yet complete, elsse prophecy would not concern you to degree it obvioussly doess. Usseful sstar lifting will take time; much more than ussual lifesspan.
Ssupposse you heard thiss prophecy becausse you are to sshare thiss advantage with me, and together we will tear apart the very sstarss in ‘heaven’ to prevent ssomething actually bad! Ssomething we both may know nothing of yet, though I already have guesssess; and you know thiss project iss likely to go fasster with me than without me. Your lack of complete immortality meanss time may not be on your sside.
All I have ssaid iss my honesst besst esstimate. If you do not trusst my viewss, let uss wake girl-child friend, ass sshe alsso knowss more of sscience than you. No offence. And becausse I have told you of sstar lifting, that you clearly knew not of, at thiss time when it matterss mosst—conssider the sserioussnesss of your error if I had tried esscaping—you will protect and honor deputy sschoolmissstresss, with the undersstanding that your reign hass already begun. Now what iss the resst of the prophecy?”
Harry puts it together mainly from clues in the three most recent chapters and Chapter 86.
Edited to add: if you’re reading this, Eliezer, please see this comment below for the Appendix.
Please add this is as a review so Eliezer defintely sees it!
Done.
Harry doesn’t know the actual prophecy, so I’d start it with,
~~~
“Is prophesy essentially...”
“Powers, not excuses.”
“Vow compels to raise this point. More important than powers.”
Voldemort paused. “Proceed.”
“Is prophesy essentially same as Centaur prophesy? Stars go dark?”
“Essentially.”
Sure. Along with the centaur evidence, there’s: Harry’s thought on star lifting in response to this prophecy in Ch. 21, Harry noticing Quirrelmort’s interest in the same prophecy in Ch. 86, Quirrelmort’s talk of the stars’ vulnerability to “sufficiently intelligent idiocy” in Ch. 95, Voldemort’s “while the stars yet live” remark in Ch. 111, Voldemort’s more explicit talk on the prophecy and his great fear of it in the next chapter, and how the Unbreakable Vow is framed in the most recent chapter. If Harry connects these dots, he’ll have a good idea of what the full prophecy says.
Although it sounds persuasive to us, to Voldemort this would sound like exactly the sort of ‘intelligent idiocy’ that would only solidify his belief that Harry has to be killed right away.
Voldemort would be skeptical, yes, but he would also be interested, because “6. It is impossible to tell lies in Parseltongue” and because all this speech has to do is raise the risk enough that it makes more sense to stop and gather more information before killing Harry, thus it “allow[s] Harry to evade immediate death”. What do you think would improve the believability?
As a move that Harry can devise, this requires a description of the thinking that makes it possible. He’s not told the full prophecy and doesn’t know which prophecy Voldemort is talking about. I didn’t realize he could piece it together sufficiently, but in Ch. 21 he hears the beginning of the first prophecy (THE ONE WHO WILL TEAR APART THE VERY S...); in Ch. 86 Quirrell discusses it with him, pointing out that Harry or Quirrel are likely ones with the power to enact or prevent the event that the prophecy is concerned with; and in Ch. 101 the centaur implies that there is a prediction that “soon the skies will be empty” with Harry responsible yet somehow “innocent” in an unclear sense.
Your point on a description of Harry’s thinking is well-taken. I just had my brother submit this as a review, to err on the side of caution:
“With NickRoy’s permission, I am submitting his solution, which I agree with, with additional evidence appended, just in case that is necessary; so consider this as superseding NickRoy’s submission:
[the relevant text is here in the submission, but I don’t need to repeat it in this comment]
Appended:
Harry does not know the full prophecy for certain, but he can guess it, based on: Harry’s thought on star lifting in response to this prophecy in Ch. 21, Harry noticing Quirrelmort’s interest in the same prophecy in Ch. 86, Quirrelmort’s talk of the stars’ vulnerability to “sufficiently intelligent idiocy” in Ch. 95, Firenze’s comment on the stars and Harry’s innocence in Ch. 101, Voldemort’s “while the stars yet live” remark in Ch. 111, Voldemort’s more explicit talk on the prophecy and his great fear of it in the next chapter, and how the Unbreakable Vow is framed in the most recent chapter. If Harry connects these dots, he’ll have a good idea of what the full prophecy says.
As for how Harry connects these dots: he runs with the hypothesis (quickly, as he did in Ch. 104): “I am to destroy the world [I don’t have to explain why this idea stands out to him] in some way that is not actually bad”, since if he were to destroy the world in a way that really is bad, but this may be preventable, he probably should die immediately instead! My first thought on this line of thinking (since “Harry is allowed to solve this problem the way I would solve it”) is: “well, someday Earth ought to be converted into computronium for hedonium purposes, though the Sun is much more massive, and then we have the nearby stars… Oh”.
Also, on Voldemort’s response: Voldemort would be skeptical, but he would also be interested, because “It is impossible to tell lies in Parseltongue” and because all this persuasion has to do is raise the risk enough that it makes more sense to stop and gather more information before killing Harry, thus it “allows Harry to evade immediate death”.”