I mostly agree on all of this, at the very least denotationally agree on everything.
I’m quite on a different end of the spectrum when it comes to whether this is morally optimized, but of course this is because I work from different assumptions and when I picture it, I also imagine a completely different social framework than most people who think this is the “right” way to do it would imagine around it.
Errh. Not sure how I could rephrase the above to make it less confusing, but hopefully your model already knows the gist of what I’m saying.
I’m not sure I understand your position—more specifically, I’m not sure what connotations you disagree with. I was trying in this instance to make statements without relevant connotation at all, but it seems that my attempts fell short.
This pattern-matches to the noncentral fallacy described by Yvain, and can be very easily read as an attempt to categorically identify abortion as nothing other than what people generally identify as “medical procedures”, while abortion clearly has some elements (even in flat-out physical materialistic terms, let alone social, moral, legal, etc.) that are not quite like most medical procedures.
If I want to push the meta-analysis a bit further...
So what?
This seems dismissive of the issues. At this point in the paragraph, it holds some connotation of “Your arguments are worthless, society is right because that’s what society decided”, which is clearly not intended (or so I would presume) but still sneaks into the reader’s stream-of-consciousness.
In general the tone of the comment feels a bit like you’re saying that society has decided something, nothing can be done about it by one individual, the Enemy’s arguments are invalid, and thus society is right. This (probably unintended) connotation is very much one I strongly disagree with.
This pattern-matches to the noncentral fallacy described by Yvain, and can be very easily read as an attempt to categorically identify abortion as nothing other than what people generally identify as “medical procedures”, while abortion clearly has some elements (even in flat-out physical materialistic terms, let alone social, moral, legal, etc.) that are not quite like most medical procedures.
Doesn’t this support my position? Even if an abortion was only a medical procedure, it wouldn’t be available to vindicate the man’s choice over the woman’s choice. And you correctly note that it isn’t only a medical procedure
This seems dismissive of the issues.
Sam says there’s only one correct moral choice. Perhaps I shouldn’t have been, but I was dismissive of that position.
Doesn’t this support my position? Even if an abortion was only a medical procedure, it wouldn’t be available to vindicate the man’s choice over the woman’s choice. And you correctly note that it isn’t only a medical procedure
Fully true. It’s the pattern-matching connotation of “Here, I argue using known fallacies” that was off-putting, more than the facts stated and the actually-implied reasoning.
I cringe at the phrase “vindicate the man’s choice over the woman’s choice”, because it’s clear to me that this isn’t a mutually exclusive two-choices-only scenario (there are more than two possible solutions to this “problem”, if one wants to think of it in these terms), but that reaction is a matter of gender-equality humanism (which most people, due to historical circumstance, refer to as “feminism”) more than the actual issue at hand.
I mostly agree on all of this, at the very least denotationally agree on everything.
I’m quite on a different end of the spectrum when it comes to whether this is morally optimized, but of course this is because I work from different assumptions and when I picture it, I also imagine a completely different social framework than most people who think this is the “right” way to do it would imagine around it.
Errh. Not sure how I could rephrase the above to make it less confusing, but hopefully your model already knows the gist of what I’m saying.
I’m not sure I understand your position—more specifically, I’m not sure what connotations you disagree with. I was trying in this instance to make statements without relevant connotation at all, but it seems that my attempts fell short.
Well, for one example:
This pattern-matches to the noncentral fallacy described by Yvain, and can be very easily read as an attempt to categorically identify abortion as nothing other than what people generally identify as “medical procedures”, while abortion clearly has some elements (even in flat-out physical materialistic terms, let alone social, moral, legal, etc.) that are not quite like most medical procedures.
If I want to push the meta-analysis a bit further...
This seems dismissive of the issues. At this point in the paragraph, it holds some connotation of “Your arguments are worthless, society is right because that’s what society decided”, which is clearly not intended (or so I would presume) but still sneaks into the reader’s stream-of-consciousness.
In general the tone of the comment feels a bit like you’re saying that society has decided something, nothing can be done about it by one individual, the Enemy’s arguments are invalid, and thus society is right. This (probably unintended) connotation is very much one I strongly disagree with.
Doesn’t this support my position? Even if an abortion was only a medical procedure, it wouldn’t be available to vindicate the man’s choice over the woman’s choice. And you correctly note that it isn’t only a medical procedure
Sam says there’s only one correct moral choice. Perhaps I shouldn’t have been, but I was dismissive of that position.
Fully true. It’s the pattern-matching connotation of “Here, I argue using known fallacies” that was off-putting, more than the facts stated and the actually-implied reasoning.
I cringe at the phrase “vindicate the man’s choice over the woman’s choice”, because it’s clear to me that this isn’t a mutually exclusive two-choices-only scenario (there are more than two possible solutions to this “problem”, if one wants to think of it in these terms), but that reaction is a matter of gender-equality humanism (which most people, due to historical circumstance, refer to as “feminism”) more than the actual issue at hand.