Just noting here that Elizabeth wasn’t at one of MAPLE’s retreats (from what I understand; I’d never set foot on MAPLE at the time of her visit). MAPLE hosts a silent meditation week about once a month. The rest of the weeks are called Responsibility Weeks. While the residents are expected to meditate throughout the day during these Weeks (but it’s really hard to because they have to use computers and stuff), guests are not expected to. Guests can just experience a different way of living and being.
MAPLE has a handful of ‘jock hippies’. Jock hippies believe things turn out all right generally. Their visceral experience is embodied. They often experience pleasurable sensations. They’re happy despite a lot of turmoil. They like walking barefoot through nature, doing vigorous forms of exercise, and interacting with strangers.
Elizabeth was on the phone with one such person, who explained things to her in a way that failed to comprehend a more typical rationalist way of experiencing the world.
But it was good of Elizabeth to come and teach MAPLE something new, and MAPLE is always learning how to better engage with their guests. There are heated debates about this where people get passionate about giving guests a more comfortable experience vs. giving guests a more monastic experience. There is always a tension here, but I do think it’s worth MAPLE understanding how to treat different people and know where they’re coming from.
MAPLE’s ‘demographic’ is one of the most diverse (culturally) that I have seen (for something that is super niche and not mainstream or well-funded), and it brings up a lot of complex scenarios. Each different cultural demographic uses language and communication in different ways, and so lots of communication errors are possible. I believe trial and error learning is needed to grow in this area.
But it would be nice if there were a way to feel more resolution with Elizabeth in particular. I will consider it myself, but, Elizabeth, if you wanted to let me know what would be beneficial for making things right, that would also be helpful.
> “There are heated debates about this where people get passionate about giving guests a more comfortable experience vs. giving guests a more monastic experience”
This seems irrelevant to my point that the experience was not accurately described (or rather was, but then was countermanded).
> “Elizabeth was on the phone with one such person, who explained things to her in a way that failed to comprehend a more typical rationalist way of experiencing the world. ”
I do not like the way you are pinning this on me being a weirdo. Living in a barely heated retreat that restricts food and sleep is the marked choice here, and if someone is incapable of noticing that is bad for some people they probably shouldn’t be the one handling inquiries from potential visitors.
> Just noting here that Elizabeth wasn’t at one of MAPLE’s retreats (from what I understand; I’d never set foot on MAPLE at the time of her visit). MAPLE hosts a silent meditation week about once a month. The rest of the weeks are called Responsibility Weeks. While the residents are expected to meditate throughout the day during these Weeks (but it’s really hard to because they have to use computers and stuff), guests are not expected to. Guests can just experience a different way of living and being.
This is inaccurate. I was indeed not at a formal retreat, but we visitors were following the same schedule as the residents for the first (several days? week?), until we complained. This schedule was similar to the one described on MAPLE’s current website as a responsibility week and included many hours of meditation per day, the timing of which restricted sleep to (6.5) hours if one could fall asleep immediately after the last meditation and wake up moments before the first one. (which I definitely can’t do). The 4 hours dedicated to work were not free time for us, I think probably we had more chores? I definitely wasn’t allowed to nap during them. When I first deviated from this schedule people definitely noticed and pushed for me to adhere to it, although some of that was relaxed later in the visit.
> But it was good of Elizabeth to come and teach MAPLE something new, and MAPLE is always learning how to better engage with their guests
I have no way of knowing what goes on inside MAPLE but this has not been evident in any of their engagement with me since, and I’m generally grossed out by the framing of “oh it all worked out because we learned from it”.
Just noting here that Elizabeth wasn’t at one of MAPLE’s retreats (from what I understand; I’d never set foot on MAPLE at the time of her visit). MAPLE hosts a silent meditation week about once a month. The rest of the weeks are called Responsibility Weeks. While the residents are expected to meditate throughout the day during these Weeks (but it’s really hard to because they have to use computers and stuff), guests are not expected to. Guests can just experience a different way of living and being.
MAPLE has a handful of ‘jock hippies’. Jock hippies believe things turn out all right generally. Their visceral experience is embodied. They often experience pleasurable sensations. They’re happy despite a lot of turmoil. They like walking barefoot through nature, doing vigorous forms of exercise, and interacting with strangers.
Elizabeth was on the phone with one such person, who explained things to her in a way that failed to comprehend a more typical rationalist way of experiencing the world.
But it was good of Elizabeth to come and teach MAPLE something new, and MAPLE is always learning how to better engage with their guests. There are heated debates about this where people get passionate about giving guests a more comfortable experience vs. giving guests a more monastic experience. There is always a tension here, but I do think it’s worth MAPLE understanding how to treat different people and know where they’re coming from.
MAPLE’s ‘demographic’ is one of the most diverse (culturally) that I have seen (for something that is super niche and not mainstream or well-funded), and it brings up a lot of complex scenarios. Each different cultural demographic uses language and communication in different ways, and so lots of communication errors are possible. I believe trial and error learning is needed to grow in this area.
But it would be nice if there were a way to feel more resolution with Elizabeth in particular. I will consider it myself, but, Elizabeth, if you wanted to let me know what would be beneficial for making things right, that would also be helpful.
Noting that I do not believe this is an accurate description of my experience but super do not feel like arguing it here.
I’m still mad about this, so:
> “There are heated debates about this where people get passionate about giving guests a more comfortable experience vs. giving guests a more monastic experience”
This seems irrelevant to my point that the experience was not accurately described (or rather was, but then was countermanded).
> “Elizabeth was on the phone with one such person, who explained things to her in a way that failed to comprehend a more typical rationalist way of experiencing the world. ”
I do not like the way you are pinning this on me being a weirdo. Living in a barely heated retreat that restricts food and sleep is the marked choice here, and if someone is incapable of noticing that is bad for some people they probably shouldn’t be the one handling inquiries from potential visitors.
> Just noting here that Elizabeth wasn’t at one of MAPLE’s retreats (from what I understand; I’d never set foot on MAPLE at the time of her visit). MAPLE hosts a silent meditation week about once a month. The rest of the weeks are called Responsibility Weeks. While the residents are expected to meditate throughout the day during these Weeks (but it’s really hard to because they have to use computers and stuff), guests are not expected to. Guests can just experience a different way of living and being.
This is inaccurate. I was indeed not at a formal retreat, but we visitors were following the same schedule as the residents for the first (several days? week?), until we complained. This schedule was similar to the one described on MAPLE’s current website as a responsibility week and included many hours of meditation per day, the timing of which restricted sleep to (6.5) hours if one could fall asleep immediately after the last meditation and wake up moments before the first one. (which I definitely can’t do). The 4 hours dedicated to work were not free time for us, I think probably we had more chores? I definitely wasn’t allowed to nap during them. When I first deviated from this schedule people definitely noticed and pushed for me to adhere to it, although some of that was relaxed later in the visit.
> But it was good of Elizabeth to come and teach MAPLE something new, and MAPLE is always learning how to better engage with their guests
I have no way of knowing what goes on inside MAPLE but this has not been evident in any of their engagement with me since, and I’m generally grossed out by the framing of “oh it all worked out because we learned from it”.