Of course, Eliezer previously stuck the non-consensual-sex thing in Three Worlds Collide, as an attempt to simulate the “future societies will likely trivialize things we consider unthinkable and there’s no way to tell what” effect.
A surprising number of people seem to have missed what the point of this was in Three Worlds Collide. It’s not a prediction about future (human) societies. AFAICT it’s there to remind people that changing values is actually bad. That when we talk about, for example, AIs getting random values instead of inheriting our human values, that we should not think of this like we think of a foreign country’s cultural quirks, we should think of this as terrifying and revolting. This is a misconception that a lot of people actually have, and TWC as a whole is aimed squarely at dispelling it.
I strongly disagree that this was the point of this in TWC and would be highly surprised if Eliezer agreed with you. For one thing, the parties involved in nonconsensual sex in TWC seem to be having a perfectly fine time. I also wouldn’t be surprised if someone raping an Ancient such that they have a terrible awful no-good time would fall under some other crime and still get the perpetrator arrested.
I don’t think those are contradictory? It can both be “there would be value drift” and “this might be quite bad, actually”. Anyway, whatever the actual actual spirit of that bit in TWC, that doesn’t change my question of wanting some clarity on whether the worse bits of Dath Ilan are intended in the same spirit.
A surprising number of people seem to have missed what the point of this was in Three Worlds Collide. It’s not a prediction about future (human) societies. AFAICT it’s there to remind people that changing values is actually bad. That when we talk about, for example, AIs getting random values instead of inheriting our human values, that we should not think of this like we think of a foreign country’s cultural quirks, we should think of this as terrifying and revolting. This is a misconception that a lot of people actually have, and TWC as a whole is aimed squarely at dispelling it.
I strongly disagree that this was the point of this in TWC and would be highly surprised if Eliezer agreed with you. For one thing, the parties involved in nonconsensual sex in TWC seem to be having a perfectly fine time. I also wouldn’t be surprised if someone raping an Ancient such that they have a terrible awful no-good time would fall under some other crime and still get the perpetrator arrested.
I don’t think those are contradictory? It can both be “there would be value drift” and “this might be quite bad, actually”. Anyway, whatever the actual actual spirit of that bit in TWC, that doesn’t change my question of wanting some clarity on whether the worse bits of Dath Ilan are intended in the same spirit.