Just read over the story (okay, browsed really so I am working on incomplete information and thus this isn’t a 100% proper assessment) so I’ll list my thoughts on the matter.
[1] Celestia here doesn’t seem to be having fun. I know well that this deals with the death of her prized student and that isn’t a thing to be happy about but there are so many other things that she doesn’t seem to enjoy. Such as when she mentions she doesn’t look at the moon anymore. Her sister controls the night, had an episode 1,000 years ago when she thought her work wasn’t being appreciated, and was recently freed from being imprisoned in the moon itself.
If Celestia made it a point to stay up and look at the moon more and maybe say, “For a millennium, I raised the sun at dawn but ignored the moon, I took it for granted. Then when I was forced to imprison my sister, I raised the moon as well. For a thousand years I carried that thing through the sky, looking at the picture of Luna imprisoned in it. Generations of ponies looke up and saw the “Mare in the Moon” not knowing who she was or if she was real.”
“Then, Twilight came and with her friends freed my sister from her curse. That day I got my sister back, and for once I could watch her raise the moon as she did all those years before. That day, I and so many others were able to look up at the beautiful moon in the sky and see it as it had been before it had been used as a prison.”
“I must say, the moon is beautiful.”
Basically.… this is character who had seen things as they were thousands of years before and watched things grow and develop and had even orchestrated a thousand year long plan to save her sisters and (to an extent) restore the moon to the way it looked per-banishment. It would make sense that she would seek to look at the beauty in things.
Or even “Heh, I remember those first few years. Every once in a while after a hard days work I would prepare for bed as I have done for centuries. Then, I would look out the window and spot the moon… only it was different! I’d blink look again to find that the Mare in the Moon was gone and I’d panic. Hah hah… I remember once I was worried that Nightmare Moon had escaped when I wasn’t looking! But then I’d remember how Luna had gotten out and Twilight freed her.”
“Then, on those nights I would find my sister standing on the top balcony, looking up at the stars as she moved them into place. I would stand there and admire them as she worked.”
“I can’t believe I never appreciated the work she puts in all those stars.”
Or whatever… I guess I’m saying that with immortal characters it would make sense to have at least one major thing that they really enjoy. Something they have done over the centuries that they are very proud of, or some hobby that they have tracked for all this time and they note how its changed. (“I pity the people who think cheddar is the only type of cheese around. I’ve traveled the world and had cheeses from all over… I’ve even got a 200 year old wheel of English Brie in the cellar… I really should crack that thing open one of these days for a special occasion. Hell, I’ll do it this thursday. Make a party of it.”).
[2] She seems to talk down to the ponies (or “mortals”) around her. I think that’s what gradually put me off Methods of Rationality and Luminosity is that the protagonists of these sorts of “Rational” stories seem to plop labels on others. Oh I know that deep down we all have habits and ingrained instincts and stuff and a sufficiently intelligent person can see those things as they really are but its rather off putting when the protagonists have such low regard of people who aren’t immortal super geniuses.
“That was why I instituted cutie marks. Mortals are like apples, and will thoughtlessly grow wherever they fall unless you give them a good kick.”
Because obviously labeling every singly pony in the world with a permanent symbol on their bodies that represents (what one can assume to be) their life goal is totally conductive to making ponies go about and try new things. IN OPPOSITE LAND!
(Sorry, about that. Its just the idea that sufficiently advanced intelligence would covertly label people with symbols to designate their status in life doesn’t seem very friendly).
[3] As far as the life vs death thing goes… I’m of the personal opinion that living beyond the point where life isn’t enjoyable isn’t necessarily a good thing. If one can increase the happiness of a living person then that’s great. If you can prolong the life of someone who is happy then that’s also good. If you prolong the life of someone who isn’t enjoying themselves… then it kind of defeats the purpose. (plus there are cases involving those who cause unhappiness for other in which case prolonging life isn’t good) The Celestia in this story doesn’t seem to enjoy herself so there really is no reason why she can’t pass on the torch to someone else who might do a better job of it.
Or alternately, have Twilight analyze whatever magical essence allows immortality and try duplicating it.
As a side note: Living for the benefit of others is also a good thing (though not ideal). If someone doesn’t personally enjoy their life but brings happiness to others then one can argue that suicide would be inappropriate.
“Twilight, I’ve never really said this before but I really don’t enjoy life… oh, I don’t hate it or anything but sometimes when I’m not working then I just feel… empty. Like whatever spark in me allows for self-enjoyment has been extinguised long ago. My purpose in this world is to raise the sun, to rule Equestria in a benevolent manner… and that’s it. I’ve eaten so much cake over the centuries that it has stopped being a novelty, sex, games, theater, books… I’ve either experienced them all or reached the point where I can’t imagine experiencing them would improve my quality of life in any way.”
“It could be a chemical imbalance, some side effect of my condition, or perhaps my mind has had so many experiences over the eons that there just isn’t that much room for anything else anymore.”
“The point is that right now I live for others. I do not fear non-existance for my own sake, I just know that if I were to… die then my little ponies would not know what to do. They need someone to lead them and care for them and right now I think you would be an ideal candidate.”
“A long and well-lived life is a blessing and I have lived over a thousand years before I found it no longer bearable. Perhaps you will last for two thousand? Heh… it is a puzzle, to live forever with only the limits of the mind to hold you back. I’m sure between you and Pinkie, you will find an answer to that.”
(sorry this came out really long and the auto-formatting made it look weird)
I think this is the big one. Sure, Celestia says that death is bad. She also describes her life as prolonged suffering and says that she envies mortals because immortals have purpose but don’t actually live. The opinions and example of Celestia aren’t necessarily to be taken as the theme of the work itself, but I can understand why people might be confused.
Well to be fair, if you hadn’t posted the story then I wouldn’t have been able to give input. One could say that it’s better to make something, see how it could be improved, and then try again than it would be to stress over “getting it right the first time” and risk it never getting finished at all.
Just read over the story (okay, browsed really so I am working on incomplete information and thus this isn’t a 100% proper assessment) so I’ll list my thoughts on the matter.
[1] Celestia here doesn’t seem to be having fun. I know well that this deals with the death of her prized student and that isn’t a thing to be happy about but there are so many other things that she doesn’t seem to enjoy. Such as when she mentions she doesn’t look at the moon anymore. Her sister controls the night, had an episode 1,000 years ago when she thought her work wasn’t being appreciated, and was recently freed from being imprisoned in the moon itself.
If Celestia made it a point to stay up and look at the moon more and maybe say, “For a millennium, I raised the sun at dawn but ignored the moon, I took it for granted. Then when I was forced to imprison my sister, I raised the moon as well. For a thousand years I carried that thing through the sky, looking at the picture of Luna imprisoned in it. Generations of ponies looke up and saw the “Mare in the Moon” not knowing who she was or if she was real.”
“Then, Twilight came and with her friends freed my sister from her curse. That day I got my sister back, and for once I could watch her raise the moon as she did all those years before. That day, I and so many others were able to look up at the beautiful moon in the sky and see it as it had been before it had been used as a prison.”
“I must say, the moon is beautiful.”
Basically.… this is character who had seen things as they were thousands of years before and watched things grow and develop and had even orchestrated a thousand year long plan to save her sisters and (to an extent) restore the moon to the way it looked per-banishment. It would make sense that she would seek to look at the beauty in things.
Or even “Heh, I remember those first few years. Every once in a while after a hard days work I would prepare for bed as I have done for centuries. Then, I would look out the window and spot the moon… only it was different! I’d blink look again to find that the Mare in the Moon was gone and I’d panic. Hah hah… I remember once I was worried that Nightmare Moon had escaped when I wasn’t looking! But then I’d remember how Luna had gotten out and Twilight freed her.”
“Then, on those nights I would find my sister standing on the top balcony, looking up at the stars as she moved them into place. I would stand there and admire them as she worked.”
“I can’t believe I never appreciated the work she puts in all those stars.”
Or whatever… I guess I’m saying that with immortal characters it would make sense to have at least one major thing that they really enjoy. Something they have done over the centuries that they are very proud of, or some hobby that they have tracked for all this time and they note how its changed. (“I pity the people who think cheddar is the only type of cheese around. I’ve traveled the world and had cheeses from all over… I’ve even got a 200 year old wheel of English Brie in the cellar… I really should crack that thing open one of these days for a special occasion. Hell, I’ll do it this thursday. Make a party of it.”).
[2] She seems to talk down to the ponies (or “mortals”) around her. I think that’s what gradually put me off Methods of Rationality and Luminosity is that the protagonists of these sorts of “Rational” stories seem to plop labels on others. Oh I know that deep down we all have habits and ingrained instincts and stuff and a sufficiently intelligent person can see those things as they really are but its rather off putting when the protagonists have such low regard of people who aren’t immortal super geniuses.
“That was why I instituted cutie marks. Mortals are like apples, and will thoughtlessly grow wherever they fall unless you give them a good kick.”
Because obviously labeling every singly pony in the world with a permanent symbol on their bodies that represents (what one can assume to be) their life goal is totally conductive to making ponies go about and try new things. IN OPPOSITE LAND!
(Sorry, about that. Its just the idea that sufficiently advanced intelligence would covertly label people with symbols to designate their status in life doesn’t seem very friendly).
[3] As far as the life vs death thing goes… I’m of the personal opinion that living beyond the point where life isn’t enjoyable isn’t necessarily a good thing. If one can increase the happiness of a living person then that’s great. If you can prolong the life of someone who is happy then that’s also good. If you prolong the life of someone who isn’t enjoying themselves… then it kind of defeats the purpose. (plus there are cases involving those who cause unhappiness for other in which case prolonging life isn’t good) The Celestia in this story doesn’t seem to enjoy herself so there really is no reason why she can’t pass on the torch to someone else who might do a better job of it.
Or alternately, have Twilight analyze whatever magical essence allows immortality and try duplicating it.
As a side note: Living for the benefit of others is also a good thing (though not ideal). If someone doesn’t personally enjoy their life but brings happiness to others then one can argue that suicide would be inappropriate.
“Twilight, I’ve never really said this before but I really don’t enjoy life… oh, I don’t hate it or anything but sometimes when I’m not working then I just feel… empty. Like whatever spark in me allows for self-enjoyment has been extinguised long ago. My purpose in this world is to raise the sun, to rule Equestria in a benevolent manner… and that’s it. I’ve eaten so much cake over the centuries that it has stopped being a novelty, sex, games, theater, books… I’ve either experienced them all or reached the point where I can’t imagine experiencing them would improve my quality of life in any way.”
“It could be a chemical imbalance, some side effect of my condition, or perhaps my mind has had so many experiences over the eons that there just isn’t that much room for anything else anymore.”
“The point is that right now I live for others. I do not fear non-existance for my own sake, I just know that if I were to… die then my little ponies would not know what to do. They need someone to lead them and care for them and right now I think you would be an ideal candidate.”
“A long and well-lived life is a blessing and I have lived over a thousand years before I found it no longer bearable. Perhaps you will last for two thousand? Heh… it is a puzzle, to live forever with only the limits of the mind to hold you back. I’m sure between you and Pinkie, you will find an answer to that.”
(sorry this came out really long and the auto-formatting made it look weird)
I think this is the big one. Sure, Celestia says that death is bad. She also describes her life as prolonged suffering and says that she envies mortals because immortals have purpose but don’t actually live. The opinions and example of Celestia aren’t necessarily to be taken as the theme of the work itself, but I can understand why people might be confused.
There are some good ideas here—I wish now I’d written this post before posting the story. It’s a little late to go back and change it now.
Hell, no! You can totally fix your stories afterward. I do it all the time. Why wouldn’t I?
Well to be fair, if you hadn’t posted the story then I wouldn’t have been able to give input. One could say that it’s better to make something, see how it could be improved, and then try again than it would be to stress over “getting it right the first time” and risk it never getting finished at all.