Wait, since when was suicide considered more sinful than murder? Do you mean killing an in-group member vs. killing an out-group member?
Interesting idea though; I’ve never thought about myself an anything other than an individual despite knowing that I’m not ultimately unique in the grand scheme of things.
“I agree with Robin Hanson that if two instances of me exist, and one is terminated, I didn’t die, I simply got smaller.”
This reminds my a lot of Eliezer’s crossover fanfic. You should check it out.
Wait, since when was suicide considered more sinful than murder?
In my experience anyway. In standard catholicism and many strains of christianity you can commit murder and still get into heaven. Forgiveness, redemption, all that. Suicide is a one-way ticket to hell with no exceptions.
This reminds my a lot of Eliezer’s crossover fanfic. You should check it out.
I’m a huge fan of Eliezer’s fic, I wish he could write more often. :( But IMHO the best example of a single identity repeated in many people is in Hal Duncan’s Vellum
In my experience anyway. In standard catholicism and many strains of christianity you can commit murder and still get into heaven. Forgiveness, redemption, all that. Suicide is a one-way ticket to hell with no exceptions.
I think this is the conclusion reached by theologians, not people’s intuitions. If I am a Catholic, and I murder someone, I can go to the Priest, confess, do penance, and be forgiven. If the person I murder is myself, I obviously can’t do that, so I die with my sins unconfessed and therefore go to hell. This is not how people normally think. If somebody commits suicide, we feel pity for them, because they must have been miserable. Murderers, however, are hunted down and imprisoned or executed.
It’s also not true. Catholicism holds that only those who commit suicide while the balance of their mind is not disturbed are incapable of going to heaven—and in practice they assume anyone who commits suicide has a disturbed mind. In effect they’re saying “If you kill yourself deliberately just so as to annoy God, then you’re a sinner. Otherwise you’re not.”
I don’t know how recently that became their standard belief, but it’s been so for at least the last few decades...
Yes and no. The Catholic Church has indeed backed off from the days when they refused to have funeral services for suicides on the presumption that they are hellbound; now they generally give the benefit of the doubt to people who commit suicide from depression, on the grounds that they may not have been sane enough to be morally responsible for their act.
However, the dogma still considers it a mortal sin if chosen deliberately by a sane person, and in particular suicide among the terminally ill is a matter of moral concern for them (or rather, keeping euthanasia illegal is a matter of political concern for them). They’re supposed to freak out at the suggestion, like a priest did in a certain recent movie where euthanasia becomes a part of the plot.
I hadn’t heard that before. My understanding is based off of a conversation with a devout catholic, but not a church official. The notion of a disturbed mind is something I haven’t heard ago. Thanks for the info.
Wait, since when was suicide considered more sinful than murder? Do you mean killing an in-group member vs. killing an out-group member?
Interesting idea though; I’ve never thought about myself an anything other than an individual despite knowing that I’m not ultimately unique in the grand scheme of things.
“I agree with Robin Hanson that if two instances of me exist, and one is terminated, I didn’t die, I simply got smaller.” This reminds my a lot of Eliezer’s crossover fanfic. You should check it out.
In my experience anyway. In standard catholicism and many strains of christianity you can commit murder and still get into heaven. Forgiveness, redemption, all that. Suicide is a one-way ticket to hell with no exceptions.
I’m a huge fan of Eliezer’s fic, I wish he could write more often. :( But IMHO the best example of a single identity repeated in many people is in Hal Duncan’s Vellum
I think this is the conclusion reached by theologians, not people’s intuitions. If I am a Catholic, and I murder someone, I can go to the Priest, confess, do penance, and be forgiven. If the person I murder is myself, I obviously can’t do that, so I die with my sins unconfessed and therefore go to hell. This is not how people normally think. If somebody commits suicide, we feel pity for them, because they must have been miserable. Murderers, however, are hunted down and imprisoned or executed.
It’s also not true. Catholicism holds that only those who commit suicide while the balance of their mind is not disturbed are incapable of going to heaven—and in practice they assume anyone who commits suicide has a disturbed mind. In effect they’re saying “If you kill yourself deliberately just so as to annoy God, then you’re a sinner. Otherwise you’re not.” I don’t know how recently that became their standard belief, but it’s been so for at least the last few decades...
Yes and no. The Catholic Church has indeed backed off from the days when they refused to have funeral services for suicides on the presumption that they are hellbound; now they generally give the benefit of the doubt to people who commit suicide from depression, on the grounds that they may not have been sane enough to be morally responsible for their act.
However, the dogma still considers it a mortal sin if chosen deliberately by a sane person, and in particular suicide among the terminally ill is a matter of moral concern for them (or rather, keeping euthanasia illegal is a matter of political concern for them). They’re supposed to freak out at the suggestion, like a priest did in a certain recent movie where euthanasia becomes a part of the plot.
I hadn’t heard that before. My understanding is based off of a conversation with a devout catholic, but not a church official. The notion of a disturbed mind is something I haven’t heard ago. Thanks for the info.