Unfortunately, analogies with Greek city states are wasted on me, because I don’t have enough knowledge about them to make deep connections. For example, how specifically did Athens solve the problem of refugees bringing their own culture, sometimes incompatible with the original values of Athens? I have no idea. Therefore I have no idea what, according to this analogy, is LW supposed to do in a similar situation.
Unless it is supposed to be just a very superficial analogy, something like ” yay individualism, sex and art! boo community, duty and survival!” in which case you have my… uhm… half-support, and I will seek the other half somewhere else.
I am not even sure whether this is supposed to be some kind of political metaphor, e.g. Spartans represent the SJWs who in their imagination take the heroic last stand against fascism, but in fact live in constant fear and keep purging their political opponents and heretics, while Athenians embrace the intellectual diversity, keep their culture alive while appropriating cool parts from other cultures, and most importantly do not forget to reproduce. (Or perhaps it is the other way round? Nope, that would be obviously silly.) Here we have a paradox, whether a part of having an “open mind” is to also include the views of those whose minds are comparatively less “open”.
I agree that it would be cool to talk more about what other people are doing. For example, I would like to see relatively short reviews of what is the state of art in other approaches to artificial intelligence. Sadly, I am unqualified to write any of that; but if someone else writes it, and I will be able to understand it and learn something new from it, they will certainly get my upvote.
Unfortunately, analogies with Greek city states are wasted on me, because I don’t have enough knowledge about them to make deep connections. For example, how specifically did Athens solve the problem of refugees bringing their own culture, sometimes incompatible with the original values of Athens?
Unless it is supposed to be just a very superficial analogy
I think it is a very superficial analogy—there’s a popular high-school-level trope that, basically, Athens made art, Sparta made war, and Athens won. Reality, as you might imagine, was considerably more complicated.
In which sense? Athens never triumphed over Sparta, they just survived, and you know why? Wikipedia tells you:
Corinth and Thebes demanded that Athens should be destroyed and all its citizens should be enslaved. However, the Spartans announced their refusal to destroy a city that had done a good service at a time of greatest danger to Greece
Unfortunately, analogies with Greek city states are wasted on me, because I don’t have enough knowledge about them to make deep connections. For example, how specifically did Athens solve the problem of refugees bringing their own culture, sometimes incompatible with the original values of Athens? I have no idea. Therefore I have no idea what, according to this analogy, is LW supposed to do in a similar situation.
Unless it is supposed to be just a very superficial analogy, something like ” yay individualism, sex and art! boo community, duty and survival!” in which case you have my… uhm… half-support, and I will seek the other half somewhere else.
I am not even sure whether this is supposed to be some kind of political metaphor, e.g. Spartans represent the SJWs who in their imagination take the heroic last stand against fascism, but in fact live in constant fear and keep purging their political opponents and heretics, while Athenians embrace the intellectual diversity, keep their culture alive while appropriating cool parts from other cultures, and most importantly do not forget to reproduce. (Or perhaps it is the other way round? Nope, that would be obviously silly.) Here we have a paradox, whether a part of having an “open mind” is to also include the views of those whose minds are comparatively less “open”.
I agree that it would be cool to talk more about what other people are doing. For example, I would like to see relatively short reviews of what is the state of art in other approaches to artificial intelligence. Sadly, I am unqualified to write any of that; but if someone else writes it, and I will be able to understand it and learn something new from it, they will certainly get my upvote.
Citizenship, and hence the right to vote, was restricted to people both whose parents were citizens.
I think it is a very superficial analogy—there’s a popular high-school-level trope that, basically, Athens made art, Sparta made war, and Athens won. Reality, as you might imagine, was considerably more complicated.
For starters the fact that Sparta actually won.
Here you are, spoiling a nice meme with actual history.
Temporarily: their allies turned on them and Athens soon rebuilt its navy. Ultimately Alexander and Rome ended the whole struggle permanently.
In which sense? Athens never triumphed over Sparta, they just survived, and you know why? Wikipedia tells you:
Doesn’t quite match your narrative, does it?