Omega could find something to say to you that you would disregard even though you knew it was a vitally important truth. Omega could tell Ghandi things that would make him kill someone. To Omega, you are as complicated as game of billiards. If you asked Omega if you had free will, Omega would say “no,” because games of billiards do not have free will. And Omega would be right, because Omega is always right.
Fortunately, Omega is unphysical.
But really, you’re free to your definition of free will, so long as we’re both just going by intuition. I don’t want to commit the typical mind fallacy too hard, here. It’s just that my intuition thinks that a creature that can be perfectly predicted and therefore manipulated by Omega doesn’t feel free-willed.
The comment’s parent and descriptions of Newcomb’s Problem.
I don’t think this line of questioning is serving you. You don’t want to challenge the obvious logical implications of your ‘unpredictable’ partial definition. They are hard to deny but don’t technically rule it out. Instead you want to question just where my own definition of ‘Free Will’ comes from if not my intuition. That, if followed through, would require appeals to authority, etc.
I would actually not argue too hard on the point of what the ‘true’ definition of Free Will is. The point that I do consider important is the assertion “If the concept Free Will requires unpredictability then it is stupid and pointless and should be discarded entirely”. I already avoid the phrase myself by habit—it just confuses people.
I’m not particularly interested in serving myself, so that’s alright. I would find it interesting if you followed through to where your definition of free will comes from. By “premises” I meant a more formal list, coming from tracing your logic.
I’m still finding this pretty interesting in part because it’s highlighting that I was prey to the typical mind fallacy. Apparently some other people don’t find it at all problematic to free will if their life is written down ahead of time, and some people do! But I still don’t know what these other people (yes, you!) do find problematic, or if they just avoid that thought.
A note: I thought this was obvious, but after some thought it may be good to mention anyhow. Killing Omega will not restore free will. Unless Omega is itself responsible for the structure of the universe—which is what my definition cares about.
Major depressio time:
Omega could find something to say to you that you would disregard even though you knew it was a vitally important truth. Omega could tell Ghandi things that would make him kill someone. To Omega, you are as complicated as game of billiards. If you asked Omega if you had free will, Omega would say “no,” because games of billiards do not have free will. And Omega would be right, because Omega is always right.
Fortunately, Omega is unphysical.
But really, you’re free to your definition of free will, so long as we’re both just going by intuition. I don’t want to commit the typical mind fallacy too hard, here. It’s just that my intuition thinks that a creature that can be perfectly predicted and therefore manipulated by Omega doesn’t feel free-willed.
I am not going by my intuition.
Because your argument from the implications for Newcomb’s problem is so empirical :D
It is quite clearly deductive, not empirical.
What are your premises, and where did they come from?
The comment’s parent and descriptions of Newcomb’s Problem.
I don’t think this line of questioning is serving you. You don’t want to challenge the obvious logical implications of your ‘unpredictable’ partial definition. They are hard to deny but don’t technically rule it out. Instead you want to question just where my own definition of ‘Free Will’ comes from if not my intuition. That, if followed through, would require appeals to authority, etc.
I would actually not argue too hard on the point of what the ‘true’ definition of Free Will is. The point that I do consider important is the assertion “If the concept Free Will requires unpredictability then it is stupid and pointless and should be discarded entirely”. I already avoid the phrase myself by habit—it just confuses people.
I’m not particularly interested in serving myself, so that’s alright. I would find it interesting if you followed through to where your definition of free will comes from. By “premises” I meant a more formal list, coming from tracing your logic.
I’m still finding this pretty interesting in part because it’s highlighting that I was prey to the typical mind fallacy. Apparently some other people don’t find it at all problematic to free will if their life is written down ahead of time, and some people do! But I still don’t know what these other people (yes, you!) do find problematic, or if they just avoid that thought.
A note: I thought this was obvious, but after some thought it may be good to mention anyhow. Killing Omega will not restore free will. Unless Omega is itself responsible for the structure of the universe—which is what my definition cares about.