Let me put it this way: Notch created Minecraft. It is awesome. There is nothing unambitious about it. It’s also something that exists entirely within a set of computers.
I suppose when I said “direct neural stimulation” it sounded like I meant something closer to wireheading. I just meant the matrix.
This is a good thing because it will encourage them to achieve more and personally grow.
I thought you were listing things you find intrinsically important.
Let me put it this way: Notch created Minecraft. It is awesome. There is nothing unambitious about it. It’s also something that exists entirely within a set of computers.
Agreed. I would count interacting with complex pieces of computing code as an “external referent.”
I suppose when I said “direct neural stimulation” it sounded like I meant something closer to wireheading. I just meant the matrix.
You’re right, when you said that I interpreted it to mean you were advocating wireheading, which I obviously find horrifying. The matrix, by contrast, is reasonably palatable.
I don’t see a world consisting mainly of matrix-dwellers as a dystopia, as long as the other people that they interact with in the matrix are real. A future where the majority of the population spends most of their time playing really complex and ambitious MMORPGs with each other would be a pretty awesome future.
I thought you were listing things you find intrinsically important.
I was, the personal growth thing is just a bonus. I probably should have left it out, it is confusing since everything else on the list involves terminal values.
Notch created Minecraft. It is awesome. There is nothing unambitious about it.
Nothing Unambitious? Really? It’s inspired by Dwarf Fortress. Being an order of magnitude or three less in depth, nuanced and challenging than the inspiration has to count as at least slightly unambitious.
I tend to regard computers as being part of the outside world. That’s why your initial comment confused me.
Still, your point that brain emulators in a matrix could live very rich, fulfilled, and happy lives that fulfill all basic human values, even if they rarely interact with the world outside the computers they inhabit, is basically sound.
That and I explained it badly. And I may or may not have originally meant wireheading and just convinced myself otherwise when it suited me. I can’t even tell.
I was giving an example of something awesome that has been done without altering the outside world. You just gave another example.
The claim “There is nothing unambitious about [minecraft]” is either plainly false or ascribed some meaning which is unrecognizable to me as my spoken language.
Let me put it this way: Notch created Minecraft. It is awesome. There is nothing unambitious about it. It’s also something that exists entirely within a set of computers.
I suppose when I said “direct neural stimulation” it sounded like I meant something closer to wireheading. I just meant the matrix.
I thought you were listing things you find intrinsically important.
Agreed. I would count interacting with complex pieces of computing code as an “external referent.”
You’re right, when you said that I interpreted it to mean you were advocating wireheading, which I obviously find horrifying. The matrix, by contrast, is reasonably palatable.
I don’t see a world consisting mainly of matrix-dwellers as a dystopia, as long as the other people that they interact with in the matrix are real. A future where the majority of the population spends most of their time playing really complex and ambitious MMORPGs with each other would be a pretty awesome future.
I was, the personal growth thing is just a bonus. I probably should have left it out, it is confusing since everything else on the list involves terminal values.
Nothing Unambitious? Really? It’s inspired by Dwarf Fortress. Being an order of magnitude or three less in depth, nuanced and challenging than the inspiration has to count as at least slightly unambitious.
Well, if you’re measuring unambitiousness against the maximum possible ambitiousness you could have, then yes, being unambitious is trivial.
This is both true and utterly inapplicable.
I was giving an example of something awesome that has been done without altering the outside world. You just gave another example.
I tend to regard computers as being part of the outside world. That’s why your initial comment confused me.
Still, your point that brain emulators in a matrix could live very rich, fulfilled, and happy lives that fulfill all basic human values, even if they rarely interact with the world outside the computers they inhabit, is basically sound.
That and I explained it badly. And I may or may not have originally meant wireheading and just convinced myself otherwise when it suited me. I can’t even tell.
The claim “There is nothing unambitious about [minecraft]” is either plainly false or ascribed some meaning which is unrecognizable to me as my spoken language.
It was an exaggeration. It’s not pure ambition, but it’s not something anyone would consider unambitious.