Everything that is on the map is also in some sense in the territory.
In a misleading sense. There are maps of Narnia, but Narnia is not in the territory. The map as meaningless squiggles of ink is in the territory, but that’s misleading.
The question is whether it is the same sense that the map claims to be or not. That’s why I dislike “real” as a category.
I don’t see how you can dispense wit the concept, even if you don’t like the word,
It’s a legacy of the times where philosophers didn’t understand map-territory relations, when they were talking about it as single variable property of
an object and not two-variable property of both object and subject.
It’s not wrong to say the territory itself is real, as a one place predicate, and it’s possible to use some other term for successful correspondence.
How it “makes difference” if then you agree that there can be no difference whatsoever?
I didn’t say it makes no difference in the sense that that it doesn’t matter. I said it could be indetectable (to finite minds). That’s not the same thing. Things you can’t know can matter a lot. For instance don’t know when you will die, but it matters to you. “isn’t detectable”, “doesn’t matter”, and “casually idle” are all different properties.
Seems very much like epiphenomenalism from my perspective. We can even construct a similar mind experiment to p-zombies with the sole difference that it will actually make sense.
Imagine there are two universes U1, U2 with exactly the same physics, yet in U1 the outcome of random events are selected through a deterministic process. Say, the universes are run on two computers in a parent universe Up, one computer uses a pseudorandom generator, and the other a “true random” one. And for the symmetry lets assume that the sequence of outcome of both random generators happened to be the same for U1 and U2. Now a Laplacian demon who knows everything about U1 and U2 will also have to know an additional fact whether the computer than implements them uses pseudorandom generator or “trully random” one, which is a fact about a parent universe Up and not U1 or U2.
Knowing that U2 is using genuine randomness is no help to the LD, because it won’t be able to make predictions. In fact, it can deduce the the existence of genuine randomness from it’s own failure. Considering only the special case where genuine randomness corresponds to pseudo randomness disguises the point. Of course, the fact that an LD would not work on a genuinely random universe is a difference that indeterminism makes.
Actually it’s even worse than that. What if Up has its own parent universe Upp? And what if Up is implemented via pseudorandom generator in Upp? Then what we thought to be a “trully random” generator in Up is also only a pseudorandom one.
Who’s we? You and I are finite and ignorant, an LD isnt. A deterministic PRNG is just part of the laws of physics, and a LD is supposed to know all the laws of physics , so it would know which PRNG the pseudo random universe is running on by default..it’s not an extra assumption. So parent universes are irrelevant: they don’t tell the LD anything it doesn’t know, and they can’t help it predict the random.
So the “libertarian free will” is an epiphenomenon. An extra badge of “metaphysical reality” without any causal effect on the decision making and moral responsibility
Again, indeterminism and free will affect the nature of causality. It’s a category error to say that causality itself is a cause. So determinism , as a form of causation , is an epiphenomenon too!
In a misleading sense. There are maps of Narnia, but Narnia is not in the territory. The map as meaningless squiggles of ink is in the territory, but that’s misleading.
I don’t see how you can dispense wit the concept, even if you don’t like the word,
It’s not wrong to say the territory itself is real, as a one place predicate, and it’s possible to use some other term for successful correspondence.
I didn’t say it makes no difference in the sense that that it doesn’t matter. I said it could be indetectable (to finite minds). That’s not the same thing. Things you can’t know can matter a lot. For instance don’t know when you will die, but it matters to you. “isn’t detectable”, “doesn’t matter”, and “casually idle” are all different properties.
Seems very much like epiphenomenalism from my perspective. We can even construct a similar mind experiment to p-zombies with the sole difference that it will actually make sense.
Knowing that U2 is using genuine randomness is no help to the LD, because it won’t be able to make predictions. In fact, it can deduce the the existence of genuine randomness from it’s own failure. Considering only the special case where genuine randomness corresponds to pseudo randomness disguises the point. Of course, the fact that an LD would not work on a genuinely random universe is a difference that indeterminism makes.
Who’s we? You and I are finite and ignorant, an LD isnt. A deterministic PRNG is just part of the laws of physics, and a LD is supposed to know all the laws of physics , so it would know which PRNG the pseudo random universe is running on by default..it’s not an extra assumption. So parent universes are irrelevant: they don’t tell the LD anything it doesn’t know, and they can’t help it predict the random.
Again, indeterminism and free will affect the nature of causality. It’s a category error to say that causality itself is a cause. So determinism , as a form of causation , is an epiphenomenon too!