Eric Raymond has a fairly good description of historical attitudes towards homosexuality here.
Edit: here is the key paragraph:
But in the other, older model, pederasty and domination sex are considered more “normal” than romantic homosexuality. In cultures with this model, the “top” in an episode of pederasty or domination sex is not necessarily considered homosexual or deviant at all; any stigma attaches to the passive partner. Romantic homosexuality is considered far more perverse, because it feminizes both partners. I think of this as the “classical” construction of homosexuality, as it describes the attitudes of ancient Rome – but it persists in cultures as near to our own as South America and the Mediterranean littoral.
First, let me be clear that I’m deriving my tentative conclusions from considering (translated) primary sources – graffitti preserved in Pompeii, descriptions of the penalties for cross-dressing in Norse sagas, the lampoons of Catullus, and Japanese accounts of homoeroticism among the samurai are among those I’m familiiar with. Closer to the present day, I have read ethnological sources on homosexuality among the Afghans and in the modern Arab world, and made at least one relevant observation first-hand a few years back, in the red-light district of Bangkok.
There are plenty of comprehensive histories of queerness. ESR just won’t read or believe any of them.
I’m emphasizing primary sources because this is one of many, many areas where contemporary scholarship is severely corrupted by politics; it is probably no longer possible to achieve tenure at a major American university after giving offense to the homosexual-activist lobby.
If you have enough primary sources relative to what the secondary sources have, and if your overall grasp of the issue is as good as that of the authors of the secondary sources.
On the other hand, if what you have is what the paragraph quoted by paper-machine suggests, and if you’ve not devoted months of thought and study to the issue (which ESR may or may not have done), it could easily be the case that you’d learn a great deal more if you paid attention to some good secondary sources.
If you have enough primary sources relative to what the secondary sources have, and if your overall grasp of the issue is as good as that of the authors of the secondary sources.
Assuming the authors of the secondary sources are interested in presenting an accurate account, as opposed believing it is there duty to lie for the “greater good”.
Yup, assuming that. Or at least assuming you can discern any lies well enough that on balance you still benefit from reading. Which is the same thing as you have to assume when reading anything else.
Just out of curiosity, have you made a careful examination of primary sources in order to tell us that
Eric Raymond has a fairly good description of historical attitudes towards homosexuality
(as opposed to, e.g., a plausible-sounding description that has been fudged “for the greater good”, or that is inaccurate because the selection of sources Eric Raymond happens to have encountered gives a misleading picture, or that is inaccurate because Eric Raymond has misunderstood something or jumped to conclusions that fit his own biases, or whatever)?
… Or is it only people on one side of any argument who should be expected to lie for the greater good, expected not to be interested in truth, and so forth?
Eric Raymond has a fairly good description of historical attitudes towards homosexuality here.
Edit: here is the key paragraph:
ESR’s not basing his “analysis” on anywhere near enough evidence. His claim that he is working from “primary sources” is laughable at best.
And your criticism of his analysis is based on...
Would be improved by more explicit comment on what for you would count as enough evidence and using primary sources.
(That isn’t a coded way of saying you’re wrong.)
There are plenty of comprehensive histories of queerness. ESR just won’t read or believe any of them.
Yes, primary sources screen out secondary sources.
If you have enough primary sources relative to what the secondary sources have, and if your overall grasp of the issue is as good as that of the authors of the secondary sources.
On the other hand, if what you have is what the paragraph quoted by paper-machine suggests, and if you’ve not devoted months of thought and study to the issue (which ESR may or may not have done), it could easily be the case that you’d learn a great deal more if you paid attention to some good secondary sources.
Assuming the authors of the secondary sources are interested in presenting an accurate account, as opposed believing it is there duty to lie for the “greater good”.
Yup, assuming that. Or at least assuming you can discern any lies well enough that on balance you still benefit from reading. Which is the same thing as you have to assume when reading anything else.
Just out of curiosity, have you made a careful examination of primary sources in order to tell us that
(as opposed to, e.g., a plausible-sounding description that has been fudged “for the greater good”, or that is inaccurate because the selection of sources Eric Raymond happens to have encountered gives a misleading picture, or that is inaccurate because Eric Raymond has misunderstood something or jumped to conclusions that fit his own biases, or whatever)?
… Or is it only people on one side of any argument who should be expected to lie for the greater good, expected not to be interested in truth, and so forth?
Not as careful as Eric but what I have seen agrees with him.
And what sources do you have?