[...]
Let the voice of reason chime, Let the friars vanish for all time, God’s face is hidden, all unseen, You can’t ask him, What it all means, He was never on your side, God was never on your side, Let right or wrong alone decide, God was never on your side. See ten thousand ministries, See the holy, righteous dogs, They claim to heal, But all they do is steal, Abuse your faith, Cheat and rob, If god is wise, Why is he still, When these false prophets, Call him friend, Why is he silent, Is he blind?! Are we abandoned in the end? Let the sword of reason shine, Let us be free of prayer and shrine, God’s face is hidden, turned way, He never has a word to say, He was never on your side, God was never on your side, Let right or wrong alone decide! God was never on your side! No, no, no! [...]
I was seeing more than militant atheism in this song. I thought that a more general message could be taken from it: use the strength of your reason, don’t believe what other people tell you by faith, life isn’t fair and we have to actively make it better. I’m still seeing all of this, to be honest, but at this point I have to admit the possibility that I’m biased, and my positive feelings about the music are conditioning me to see more in the text than what’s really in it.
Yes, probably, I just happened to be listening to Kiss of Death at the time :)
But that’s a bad message! When told “think for yourself”, people just ignore the experts and make stuff up and end up worse off.
Well, if you really think for yourself, then it’s not a bad advice*. This of course doesn’t mean “disregard all the experts’ opinions, ignore all evidence and come up with whatever conclusion you like more”, which probably is how most people interpret the sentence, I have to admit.
*Assuming that losing the time to do that doesn’t return negative utility. Ok, I have to concede that the issue requires a more delicate treatment.
I’m a little torn—it still seems too long, and the line “all they do is steal” guarantees that our theists (all eight of them) will take it the wrong way, but parts seem quite good.
I re-analyzed my motivations and honestly I don’t think I was trying to signal. There’s a small possibility that part of the motivation for the post was a sort of counter-signaling (“Hey, look at me, I listen to Motorhead!”), but for what I can reconstruct I honestly thought it was a good rationality quote. I may overvalue the quote because I like the song, of course, but I still think it has some good content. While the focus here is on God, the message that can be taken from it is, in my opinion, broader.
You mentioned signalling concerns, and I stopped for a moment to think if they were motivated (i.e. if there was a hidden will to signal). I’m here to be less wrong after all ;)
Also, why would Motorhead be counter-signalling?
In my experience it’s not common for high IQ people to listen to hard rock / heavy metal. Indirectly mentioning that instead I do, could have looked like counter-signalling.
Motorhead—God Was Never on Your Side
On YouTube.
Formatting note: You can do
a line break
without
a paragraph break
by putting two spaces at the end of a line.
Thank you, edited. Is this the reason for the downvoting, or is there something else?
I have a policy of down-voting quotes that are simply anti-religious cheering.
Thank you for sharing your reasons.
I was seeing more than militant atheism in this song. I thought that a more general message could be taken from it: use the strength of your reason, don’t believe what other people tell you by faith, life isn’t fair and we have to actively make it better. I’m still seeing all of this, to be honest, but at this point I have to admit the possibility that I’m biased, and my positive feelings about the music are conditioning me to see more in the text than what’s really in it.
But that’s a bad message! When told “think for yourself”, people just ignore the experts and make stuff up and end up worse off.
...plus, No voices in the sky is way better.
Yes, probably, I just happened to be listening to Kiss of Death at the time :)
Well, if you really think for yourself, then it’s not a bad advice*. This of course doesn’t mean “disregard all the experts’ opinions, ignore all evidence and come up with whatever conclusion you like more”, which probably is how most people interpret the sentence, I have to admit.
*Assuming that losing the time to do that doesn’t return negative utility. Ok, I have to concede that the issue requires a more delicate treatment.
I’m a little torn—it still seems too long, and the line “all they do is steal” guarantees that our theists (all eight of them) will take it the wrong way, but parts seem quite good.
Eh, upvoted to −1.
Length is indeed another possible problem, thank you.
Maybe people just don’t like it. FWIW, I upvoted it.
I didn’t (up/down)vote (the grandparent) but I imagine it’s a combination of signalling concerns and a distaste for anything resembling theism.
Thank you for sharing your considerations.
I re-analyzed my motivations and honestly I don’t think I was trying to signal. There’s a small possibility that part of the motivation for the post was a sort of counter-signaling (“Hey, look at me, I listen to Motorhead!”), but for what I can reconstruct I honestly thought it was a good rationality quote. I may overvalue the quote because I like the song, of course, but I still think it has some good content. While the focus here is on God, the message that can be taken from it is, in my opinion, broader.
I was analysing the motivations of the downvoters, not yours. Also, why would Motorhead be counter-signalling?
You mentioned signalling concerns, and I stopped for a moment to think if they were motivated (i.e. if there was a hidden will to signal). I’m here to be less wrong after all ;)
In my experience it’s not common for high IQ people to listen to hard rock / heavy metal. Indirectly mentioning that instead I do, could have looked like counter-signalling.