I agree with your main point, and I sometimes use the phrases in the same way. But what do you say when they ask you for details anyways? I mostly interact with non-rationalists, and my experience is that after people make a claim about skill or intuition, they’re usually unable to explain further (or unwilling to the point of faking ignorance). If I’m talking to someone I trust to be honest with me and I keep trying to pin down an answer, it seems to eventually reduce to the claim that an explanation is impossible. A few people have said exactly that, but a claim like “you’ll just know once you have more experience” is more common.
In a situation like this, what approach would get you to give more detail? I’d be happy with “you need to understand skills D through I before I answer you,” but I’m rarely able to get that.
For me personally, a long career in a particular public service sector has made me surprisingly efficient at smilingly, politely ignoring what people say and digging out information from an unwilling audience. When someone drops a blanket ‘You must fulfil condition Y to truly understand foo’ statement,I respond by seeing it as an interrogatory challenge :-)
When people try to push me off with a ‘I can’t explain’ or ‘You need more experience’ type of response, I usually deflect it by nodding, smiling broadly, and saying something along the lines of “I’m very smart, interested in your thought process, and have the patience to sit here while you figure out how to say what it is you want to say,′ or ‘The best way for me to get experience is to learn from someone with it.’. I find in these situations a little bit of an ego jab also works wonders in getting people to enunciate their opinions—YMMV. Refer to your local Zen Master for tips and tricks.
Also, asking leading but open questions can help people articulate their rationalisations in a way that they hadn’t considered before. I like to raise contrary-hypotheses - ‘What would need to be different about the real world for this theory not to work?’ / ‘If I/You were wrong about X, how would we be able to tell?’.
People who have a great depth of expertise in an area will often be cozignant of other people in that ideaspace who they mildly or strongly disagree with, and sometimes by getting people to differentiate between themselves and other thinkers, they might be able to articulate their points a little
If I’m in a teaching situation, I’ll usually try and find a gaming metaphor that will fit. “International share transfer pricing is the end boss of tax law. You’re still halfway through the main quest and you don’t have all the items you need yet’. More generally, I fall back on car driving / plane flying / SCUBA diving analogies, as they’re all pretty unviersally understood, even in the abstract.
One final alternative—and I use this on precociously inquiring children more than adults—is to deflect into academia/ “Gee, that’s an interesting question about black holes, what does your Encyclopaedia of Space say?”
I agree with your main point, and I sometimes use the phrases in the same way. But what do you say when they ask you for details anyways? I mostly interact with non-rationalists, and my experience is that after people make a claim about skill or intuition, they’re usually unable to explain further (or unwilling to the point of faking ignorance). If I’m talking to someone I trust to be honest with me and I keep trying to pin down an answer, it seems to eventually reduce to the claim that an explanation is impossible. A few people have said exactly that, but a claim like “you’ll just know once you have more experience” is more common.
In a situation like this, what approach would get you to give more detail? I’d be happy with “you need to understand skills D through I before I answer you,” but I’m rarely able to get that.
For me personally, a long career in a particular public service sector has made me surprisingly efficient at smilingly, politely ignoring what people say and digging out information from an unwilling audience. When someone drops a blanket ‘You must fulfil condition Y to truly understand foo’ statement,I respond by seeing it as an interrogatory challenge :-)
When people try to push me off with a ‘I can’t explain’ or ‘You need more experience’ type of response, I usually deflect it by nodding, smiling broadly, and saying something along the lines of “I’m very smart, interested in your thought process, and have the patience to sit here while you figure out how to say what it is you want to say,′ or ‘The best way for me to get experience is to learn from someone with it.’. I find in these situations a little bit of an ego jab also works wonders in getting people to enunciate their opinions—YMMV. Refer to your local Zen Master for tips and tricks.
Also, asking leading but open questions can help people articulate their rationalisations in a way that they hadn’t considered before. I like to raise contrary-hypotheses - ‘What would need to be different about the real world for this theory not to work?’ / ‘If I/You were wrong about X, how would we be able to tell?’.
People who have a great depth of expertise in an area will often be cozignant of other people in that ideaspace who they mildly or strongly disagree with, and sometimes by getting people to differentiate between themselves and other thinkers, they might be able to articulate their points a little
If I’m in a teaching situation, I’ll usually try and find a gaming metaphor that will fit. “International share transfer pricing is the end boss of tax law. You’re still halfway through the main quest and you don’t have all the items you need yet’. More generally, I fall back on car driving / plane flying / SCUBA diving analogies, as they’re all pretty unviersally understood, even in the abstract.
One final alternative—and I use this on precociously inquiring children more than adults—is to deflect into academia/ “Gee, that’s an interesting question about black holes, what does your Encyclopaedia of Space say?”