I’m not sure knitting and reading LW are analogous enough for this to be a good intuition pump. A conference about psychology or gender studies or nursery (to take examples from this thread) would be a better example (and while you’re at it, you’d have to replace the suit and tie with something like a muscle shirt and hair gel).
you’d have to replace the suit and tie with something like a muscle shirt and hair gel
In what way “muscle shirt and hair gel” are to men as “heels and lipstick” are to women?
(Not a rhetorical question. The first sounds like an exception and the second like a rule, and “suit and tie” also feels closer to a rule. I mean, mom usually wears heels and lipstick, and dad usually wears suits and ties. (For the record, I don’t wear either.) I’m wondering where our intuitions diverge and why.)
On thinking of heels and lipstick, I think of ‘something people wear in places where they’re looking for potential mates, such as nightclubs’, whereas on thinking of suits and ties I think of ‘something people wear in formal situations, such as on the workplace by white-collar workers’. (I’m assuming they were talking of bright-coloured lipstick and high heels, given that they were talking about it at all—I’d guess barely-visible lipstick and not-so-high heels wouldn’t be salient enough to be mentioned.)
As far as I can tell, a supermajority of men would never even consider wearing heels and lipstick, except in costume parties and the like. Suits and ties are nowhere near as strongly gendered than that.
Now maybe there isn’t quite a perfect match to “heels and lipstick”, but I can’t think of any better one at the moment.
And my view may be slightly skewed the other way because (contrary to what I’ve heard is a common stereotype) people in my country tend to not be terribly dressy by First World standards except in certain situations.
On thinking of heels and lipstick, I think of ‘something people wear in places where they’re looking for potential mates, such as nightclubs’, whereas on thinking of suits and ties I think of ‘something people wear in formal situations, such as on the workplace by white-collar workers’. (I’m assuming they were talking of bright-coloured lipstick and high heels, given that they were talking about it at all—I’d guess barely-visible lipstick and not-so-high heels wouldn’t be salient enough to be mentioned.)
As far as I can tell, a supermajority of men would never even consider wearing heels and lipstick, except in costume parties and the like. Suits and ties are nowhere near as strongly gendered than that.
Now maybe there isn’t quite a perfect match to “heels and lipstick”, but I can’t think of any better one at the moment.
I’m not sure knitting and reading LW are analogous enough for this to be a good intuition pump. A conference about psychology or gender studies or nursery (to take examples from this thread) would be a better example (and while you’re at it, you’d have to replace the suit and tie with something like a muscle shirt and hair gel).
In what way “muscle shirt and hair gel” are to men as “heels and lipstick” are to women?
(Not a rhetorical question. The first sounds like an exception and the second like a rule, and “suit and tie” also feels closer to a rule. I mean, mom usually wears heels and lipstick, and dad usually wears suits and ties. (For the record, I don’t wear either.) I’m wondering where our intuitions diverge and why.)
On thinking of heels and lipstick, I think of ‘something people wear in places where they’re looking for potential mates, such as nightclubs’, whereas on thinking of suits and ties I think of ‘something people wear in formal situations, such as on the workplace by white-collar workers’. (I’m assuming they were talking of bright-coloured lipstick and high heels, given that they were talking about it at all—I’d guess barely-visible lipstick and not-so-high heels wouldn’t be salient enough to be mentioned.)
As far as I can tell, a supermajority of men would never even consider wearing heels and lipstick, except in costume parties and the like. Suits and ties are nowhere near as strongly gendered than that.
Now maybe there isn’t quite a perfect match to “heels and lipstick”, but I can’t think of any better one at the moment.
OK, probably I’ve a skewed view because of my mom being dressier than average, and too little familiarity with white-collar workplaces and nightclubs.
And my view may be slightly skewed the other way because (contrary to what I’ve heard is a common stereotype) people in my country tend to not be terribly dressy by First World standards except in certain situations.
On thinking of heels and lipstick, I think of ‘something people wear in places where they’re looking for potential mates, such as nightclubs’, whereas on thinking of suits and ties I think of ‘something people wear in formal situations, such as on the workplace by white-collar workers’. (I’m assuming they were talking of bright-coloured lipstick and high heels, given that they were talking about it at all—I’d guess barely-visible lipstick and not-so-high heels wouldn’t be salient enough to be mentioned.)
As far as I can tell, a supermajority of men would never even consider wearing heels and lipstick, except in costume parties and the like. Suits and ties are nowhere near as strongly gendered than that.
Now maybe there isn’t quite a perfect match to “heels and lipstick”, but I can’t think of any better one at the moment.