I think we’re talking past each other, so we’d better park it and come back to the topic later and more carefully.
I do feel like you’re misrepresenting my position, so I am going to respond and then quit there. You’re welcome to respond; I’ll try to resist carrying on, and move on to more productive things. I apologize for my somewhat argumentative tone. These are things I feel strongly about, since I think MIRIs communication might matter quite a lot, but that’s not a good reason to get argumentative.
Strawmanning: I’m afraid you’r right that I’m probably exaggerating MIRI’s claims. I don’t think it’s quite a strawman; “if we build it we all die” is very much the tone I get from MIRI comms on LW and X (mostly EY), but I do note that I haven’t seen him use 99.9%+ in some time, so maybe he’s already doing some of what I suggest. And I haven’t surveyed all of MIRIs official comms. But what we’re discussing is a change in comms strategy.
I have gotten more strident in repeated attempts to make my central point clearer. That’s my fault; you weren’t addressing my actual concern so I kept trying to highlight it. I still am not sure if you’re understanding my main point, but that’s fine; I can try to say it better in future iterations.
This is the first place I can see you suggesting that I’m exaggerating MIRIs tone, so if it’s your central concern that’s weird. But again, it’s a valid complaint; I won’t make that characterization in more public places, lest it hurt MIRI’s credibility.
MIRI claiming to accurately represent scientific consensus was never my suggestion, I don’t know where you got that. I clarified that I expect zero additional effort or strong claims, just “different experts believe a lot of different things”.
Honesty: I tried to specify from the first that I’m not suggesting dishonesty by any normal standard. Accurately reporting a (vague) range of others’ opinions is just as honest as reporting your own opinion. Not saying the least convincing part the loudest might be dishonesty by radical honesty standards, but I thought rationalists had more or less agreed that those aren’t a reasonable target. That standard of honesty would kind of conflict with having a “comms strategy” at all.
I think we’re talking past each other, so we’d better park it and come back to the topic later and more carefully.
I do feel like you’re misrepresenting my position, so I am going to respond and then quit there. You’re welcome to respond; I’ll try to resist carrying on, and move on to more productive things. I apologize for my somewhat argumentative tone. These are things I feel strongly about, since I think MIRIs communication might matter quite a lot, but that’s not a good reason to get argumentative.
Strawmanning: I’m afraid you’r right that I’m probably exaggerating MIRI’s claims. I don’t think it’s quite a strawman; “if we build it we all die” is very much the tone I get from MIRI comms on LW and X (mostly EY), but I do note that I haven’t seen him use 99.9%+ in some time, so maybe he’s already doing some of what I suggest. And I haven’t surveyed all of MIRIs official comms. But what we’re discussing is a change in comms strategy.
I have gotten more strident in repeated attempts to make my central point clearer. That’s my fault; you weren’t addressing my actual concern so I kept trying to highlight it. I still am not sure if you’re understanding my main point, but that’s fine; I can try to say it better in future iterations.
This is the first place I can see you suggesting that I’m exaggerating MIRIs tone, so if it’s your central concern that’s weird. But again, it’s a valid complaint; I won’t make that characterization in more public places, lest it hurt MIRI’s credibility.
MIRI claiming to accurately represent scientific consensus was never my suggestion, I don’t know where you got that. I clarified that I expect zero additional effort or strong claims, just “different experts believe a lot of different things”.
Honesty: I tried to specify from the first that I’m not suggesting dishonesty by any normal standard. Accurately reporting a (vague) range of others’ opinions is just as honest as reporting your own opinion. Not saying the least convincing part the loudest might be dishonesty by radical honesty standards, but I thought rationalists had more or less agreed that those aren’t a reasonable target. That standard of honesty would kind of conflict with having a “comms strategy” at all.