In 1921, Japan was an industrial Western-style empire.
In 2021, Japan is a post-industrial, democratic, liberalish nation-state.
What got Japan to break out of its isolation? The United States threatened to burn down its capitol.
What got Japan to abandon its empire? The United States actually did burn down its capitol. B-29s dropped firebombs on defenseless cities full of women, children and the elderly. 100,000 civilians were killed in Tokyo alone.
This isn’t a criticism of the United States. Between Nazi Germany, the Japanese Empire, the Soviet Union and the United States, the United States was the closest thing there was to “the good guys”.
least evil≠good
My great grandfather served on the US Merchant Marine. His job was to operate ships carrying weapons and equipment from the United States to Europe while dodging U-boats. After Germany surrendered, he wanted to drop punitive atomic bombs on German cities.
I understand his perspective. He was a Jew.
The Advance of Modern Civilization
“It took centuries for science to dawn over the Muggle world, it only happened slowly, but the stronger science got, the further that sort of hatred retreated.” Harry’s voice was quiet, now. “I don’t know exactly why it worked that way, but that’s how it happened historically. As though there’s something in science like the shine of the Patronus Charm, driving back all sorts of darkness and madness, not right away, but it seems to follow wherever science goes.”
Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres claims that the advance of science reduced hatred. We had science in 1945. But did we really have less hatred then in, say, 1845?
Yes. Yes we did. Slavery was legal in the United States in 1845. It ended because the industrial capacity of the Union crushed the plantation-based economy of the Confederacy. Just like the industrial capacity of the United States and manpower of the Soviet Union crushed their enemies in World War II.
Are you noticing the pattern yet? Modern industrial societies produce so much of everything they outcompete slave-based societies[1] based around raw materials.
The Enlightenment, that was what it was called in the Muggle world. It has something to do with seeking the truth, I think… with being able to change your mind from what you grew up believing… with thinking logically, realizing that there’s no reason to hate someone because their skin is a different color, just like there’s no reason to hate Hermione Granger… or maybe there’s something to it that even I don’t understand. But the Enlightenment is something that you and I belong to now, both of us. Fixing Slytherin House is just one of the things we have to do.
Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres believes hatred decreased because Enlightenment ideals encouraged us to change our minds. I claim hatred decreased because the material bounty of technological advancement increased the competitive advantage of cooperation compared to violence.
Is there a way to test this? To do so we’d need to examine a nation where Enlightenment ideals came before industrialization or a nation where industrialization came before Enlightenment ideals. History provides us with both.
Meiji Japan industrialized without subscribing to Enlightenment ideals.
The United States was founded with Enlightenment ideals before it industrialized.
What happened?
The United States exterminated the Native Americans. The United States’ universalist ideals took hold after it industrialized, not before. It had people in concentration camps all the way up to 1945.
Meiji Japan comitted atrocity after atrocity even after it industrialized, all the way up to 1945.
Meiji Japan abolished the samurai class.
The United States abolished slavery (eventually).
The ultimate strategic objectives for Japan’s and the United States’ East Asian conquests were identical. They both wanted buffer states against the Soviet Union and access to raw materials. If Japan and the United States had such similar interests then why did the United States build up its conquests while Japan enslaved them? Japan did industrialize Korea and Manchuria. The United States did a better job because it had 5× the industrial capacity of the Japanese Empire at the Japanese Empire’s peak. The United States had so much wheat it shipped the surplus to starving occupied Japan for free. Japanese cuisine is dominated by rice. The United States shipped so much wheat to Japan it basically created a national dish. Ramen noodles are popular in Japan today because they needed a way to eat all that wheat.
It’s hard to hate other people for hogging all the wheat when there is too much wheat to go around. We have so much corn we ferment it into ethanol so we can burn it[2].
Subjugating other people requires coordination. The more of value we produce, the less it’s worthwhile to spend that coordination extracting tiny bits of material value from other people. It you want to bring hatred to modern lows and equality to modern highs, it’s not enough just to industrialize a little. You have to industrialize a nation so much its people can’t be bothered to oppress others because they have better things to do with their time. Hatred has decreased because we live in the golden age of all golden ages.
Technically, there is an even stronger causation in the opposite direction: we grow so much corn because we can burn it. The economics of biofuels are beyond the scope of this comment.
Worth noting that Northern states abolished slavery long before industrialization. Perhaps even more striking, the British Empire (mostly) abolished slavery during the peak of its profitability. In both cases (and many others across the world), moral arguments seem to have played a very large role.
In 1821, Japan was a feudal isolationist polity.
In 1921, Japan was an industrial Western-style empire.
In 2021, Japan is a post-industrial, democratic, liberalish nation-state.
What got Japan to break out of its isolation? The United States threatened to burn down its capitol.
What got Japan to abandon its empire? The United States actually did burn down its capitol. B-29s dropped firebombs on defenseless cities full of women, children and the elderly. 100,000 civilians were killed in Tokyo alone.
This isn’t a criticism of the United States. Between Nazi Germany, the Japanese Empire, the Soviet Union and the United States, the United States was the closest thing there was to “the good guys”.
least evil≠good
My great grandfather served on the US Merchant Marine. His job was to operate ships carrying weapons and equipment from the United States to Europe while dodging U-boats. After Germany surrendered, he wanted to drop punitive atomic bombs on German cities.
I understand his perspective. He was a Jew.
The Advance of Modern Civilization
Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres claims that the advance of science reduced hatred. We had science in 1945. But did we really have less hatred then in, say, 1845?
Yes. Yes we did. Slavery was legal in the United States in 1845. It ended because the industrial capacity of the Union crushed the plantation-based economy of the Confederacy. Just like the industrial capacity of the United States and manpower of the Soviet Union crushed their enemies in World War II.
Are you noticing the pattern yet? Modern industrial societies produce so much of everything they outcompete slave-based societies[1] based around raw materials.
Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres believes hatred decreased because Enlightenment ideals encouraged us to change our minds. I claim hatred decreased because the material bounty of technological advancement increased the competitive advantage of cooperation compared to violence.
Is there a way to test this? To do so we’d need to examine a nation where Enlightenment ideals came before industrialization or a nation where industrialization came before Enlightenment ideals. History provides us with both.
Meiji Japan industrialized without subscribing to Enlightenment ideals.
The United States was founded with Enlightenment ideals before it industrialized.
What happened?
The United States exterminated the Native Americans. The United States’ universalist ideals took hold after it industrialized, not before. It had people in concentration camps all the way up to 1945.
Meiji Japan comitted atrocity after atrocity even after it industrialized, all the way up to 1945.
Meiji Japan abolished the samurai class.
The United States abolished slavery (eventually).
The ultimate strategic objectives for Japan’s and the United States’ East Asian conquests were identical. They both wanted buffer states against the Soviet Union and access to raw materials. If Japan and the United States had such similar interests then why did the United States build up its conquests while Japan enslaved them? Japan did industrialize Korea and Manchuria. The United States did a better job because it had 5× the industrial capacity of the Japanese Empire at the Japanese Empire’s peak. The United States had so much wheat it shipped the surplus to starving occupied Japan for free. Japanese cuisine is dominated by rice. The United States shipped so much wheat to Japan it basically created a national dish. Ramen noodles are popular in Japan today because they needed a way to eat all that wheat.
It’s hard to hate other people for hogging all the wheat when there is too much wheat to go around. We have so much corn we ferment it into ethanol so we can burn it[2].
Subjugating other people requires coordination. The more of value we produce, the less it’s worthwhile to spend that coordination extracting tiny bits of material value from other people. It you want to bring hatred to modern lows and equality to modern highs, it’s not enough just to industrialize a little. You have to industrialize a nation so much its people can’t be bothered to oppress others because they have better things to do with their time. Hatred has decreased because we live in the golden age of all golden ages.
This post is focused on conflicts between civilizations. I’m ignoring hunter-gatherers and pastoralists.
Technically, there is an even stronger causation in the opposite direction: we grow so much corn because we can burn it. The economics of biofuels are beyond the scope of this comment.
I thought what broke Japan was a credible threat of being nuked rather than the firebombings
Worth noting that Northern states abolished slavery long before industrialization. Perhaps even more striking, the British Empire (mostly) abolished slavery during the peak of its profitability. In both cases (and many others across the world), moral arguments seem to have played a very large role.