Firstly, epistemology goes first. You don’t know anything about reality without having the means to acquire knowledge. Secondly, I didn’t say it was the PNC was actually false.
This is irrational. Examples of relationships do not depend on whether the example is real or not
So there is a relationship between the Miller and Popper papers conclusions, and it’s assumptions. Of course there is. That is what I am saying. But you were citing it as an example of a criticism that doesn’t depend on assumptions.
Your argument proposes a criticism of Popper’s argument
No, it proposes a criticism of your argument … the criticsm that there is a contradiction between your claim that the paper makes no assumptions, and the fact that it evidently does.
So there is a relationship between the Miller and Popper papers conclusions, and it’s assumptions. Of course there is. That is what I am saying. But you were citing it as an example of a criticism that doesn’t depend on assumptions.
> Your argument proposes a criticism of Popper’s argument
No, it proposes a criticism of your argument … the criticsm that there is a contradiction between your claim that the paper makes no assumptions, and the fact that it evidently does.
I didn’t claim that paper made no assumptions. I claimed that refuting that argument^[1] would not refute CR, and vice versa. Please review the thread, I think there’s been some significant miscommunications. If something’s unclear to you, you can quote it to point it out.
Firstly, epistemology goes first. You don’t know anything about reality without having the means to acquire knowledge.
Inductivism is not compatible with this—it has no way to bootstrap except by some other, more foundational epistemic factors.
Also, you didn’t really respond to my point or the chain of discussion-logic before that. I said an internal contradiction would be a way to refute an idea (as a second example when you asked for examples). you said contradictions being bad is an assumption. i said no, it’s a conclusion, and offered an explanation (which you’ve ignored). In fact, through this discussion you haven’t—as far as I can see—actually been interested in figuring out a) what anything else things or b) where and what you might be wrong about.
Secondly, I didn’t say it was the PNC was actually false.
I don’t think there’s any point talking about this, then. We haven’t had any meaningful discussion about it and I don’t see why we would.
I didn’t claim that paper made no assumptions. I claimed that refuting that argument[1] would not refute CR, and vice versa
Theoretically, if CR consists of a set of claims , then refuting one claim wouldn’t refute the rest. In practice , critrats are dogmatically wedded to the non existence of any form of induction.
Inductivism is not compatible with this—it has no way to bootstrap except by some other, more foundational epistemic factors.
I don’t particularly identify as an inductivist , and I don’t think that the critrat version of inductivism, is what self identified inductivists believe in.
i said no, it’s a conclusion, and offered an explanation (which you’ve ignored)
Conclusion from what? The conclusion will be based on some deeper assumption.
you haven’t—as far as I can see—actually been interested in figuring out a) what anything else things
What anyone else thinks?
I am very familiar with popular CR since I used to hang out in the same forums as Curi. I’ve also read some if the great man’s works.
Anecdote time: after a long discussion about the existence of any form of induction , on a CR forum, someone eventually popped up who had asked KRP the very question, after bumping into him at a conference many years ago , and his reply was that it existed , but wasn’t suitable for science.
But of course the true believing critrats weren’t convinced by Word of God.
Secondly, I didn’t say it was the PNC was actually false.
I don’t think there’s any point talking about this, then.
The point is that every claim in general depends on assumptions. So, in particular, the critrats don’t have a disproof of induction that floats free of assumptions.
I am uncomfortable with this practice. I think I am banned from participating in curi’s forum now anyway due to my comments here so it doesn’t affect me personally but it is a little strange to have this list with people’s personal information up.
Anecdote time: after a long discussion about the existence of any form of induction , on a CR forum, someone eventually popped up who had asked KRP the very question, after bumping into him at a conference many years ago , and his reply was that it existed , but wasn’t suitable for science.
What anyone else thinks? I am very familiar with popular CR since I used to hang out in the same forums as Curi. I’ve also read some if the great man’s works.
Firstly, epistemology goes first. You don’t know anything about reality without having the means to acquire knowledge. Secondly, I didn’t say it was the PNC was actually false.
So there is a relationship between the Miller and Popper papers conclusions, and it’s assumptions. Of course there is. That is what I am saying. But you were citing it as an example of a criticism that doesn’t depend on assumptions.
No, it proposes a criticism of your argument … the criticsm that there is a contradiction between your claim that the paper makes no assumptions, and the fact that it evidently does.
I didn’t claim that paper made no assumptions. I claimed that refuting that argument^[1] would not refute CR, and vice versa. Please review the thread, I think there’s been some significant miscommunications. If something’s unclear to you, you can quote it to point it out.
[1]: for clarity, the argument in Q: A proof of the impossibility of inductive probability.
Inductivism is not compatible with this—it has no way to bootstrap except by some other, more foundational epistemic factors.
Also, you didn’t really respond to my point or the chain of discussion-logic before that. I said an internal contradiction would be a way to refute an idea (as a second example when you asked for examples). you said contradictions being bad is an assumption. i said no, it’s a conclusion, and offered an explanation (which you’ve ignored). In fact, through this discussion you haven’t—as far as I can see—actually been interested in figuring out a) what anything else things or b) where and what you might be wrong about.
I don’t think there’s any point talking about this, then. We haven’t had any meaningful discussion about it and I don’t see why we would.
Theoretically, if CR consists of a set of claims , then refuting one claim wouldn’t refute the rest. In practice , critrats are dogmatically wedded to the non existence of any form of induction.
I don’t particularly identify as an inductivist , and I don’t think that the critrat version of inductivism, is what self identified inductivists believe in.
Conclusion from what? The conclusion will be based on some deeper assumption.
What anyone else thinks? I am very familiar with popular CR since I used to hang out in the same forums as Curi. I’ve also read some if the great man’s works.
Anecdote time: after a long discussion about the existence of any form of induction , on a CR forum, someone eventually popped up who had asked KRP the very question, after bumping into him at a conference many years ago , and his reply was that it existed , but wasn’t suitable for science.
But of course the true believing critrats weren’t convinced by Word of God.
The point is that every claim in general depends on assumptions. So, in particular, the critrats don’t have a disproof of induction that floats free of assumptions.
1
I just discovered he keeps a wall of shame for people who left his forum:
http://curi.us/2215-list-of-fallible-ideas-evaders
Are you in this wall?
I am uncomfortable with this practice. I think I am banned from participating in curi’s forum now anyway due to my comments here so it doesn’t affect me personally but it is a little strange to have this list with people’s personal information up.
Source?
Which forums? Under what name?