It is definitely true that this could be someone’s subjective probability, if he he doesn’t understand the statement.
But if you do understand it, a thing which is logically impossible doesn’t exist, so the probability that a thing doesn’t exist will be equal to or higher than the probability that it is logically impossible.
I feel like I might understand now. Can I represent your points as follows:
all instances of things which are logically impossible also don’t exist
therefore, there are more things which don’t exist than those that are logically impossible
Assuming statement 1 is correct, without accepting a further premise I don’t feel compelled to accept the second premise. It sounds like things which are logically impossible may in fact be equivelant to things which don’t exist, and vice-versa. And that sounds intuitively compelling. If something was logically possible, it would happen. If it is wasn’t possible, it’s not going to happen. Or, the agent’s modelling of the world is wrong.
Importantly, I don’t accept premise 1, as I’ve indicated in another comment reply (something about how I find I’m wrong about the apparent impossibility of something, or possibility of something.)
I said “so the probability that a thing doesn’t exist will be equal to or higher than etc.” exactly because the probability would be equal if non-existence and logical impossibility turned out to be equivalent.
If you don’t agree that no logically impossible thing exists, then of course you might disagree with this probability assignment.
Well, the conclusion should read not “more things” but “at least as many”. Things might accidentally not exist.
I feel the fact that you reject premise 1 just means that you don’t really grasp the concept of impossibility, logical or otherwise… Or you have a different concept of existence.
The reason why I used a semi-formal notation was to suggest that if you formalise it all, you can actually prove “P(x doesn’t exist) ≥ P(x is impossible)” as a tautology. (Ignoring the issue that with specifically logical impossibility, you get into a bit of trouble with probability assignments to tautologies.)
Uhm, what? Why? Bla bla bla indeed. (Sorry, I couldn’t resist.) It’s not actually very relevant.
If you don’t believe that logical (or, for that matter, any other sort of) impossibility implies non-existence, then you are understanding either “logical impossibility” or “non-existence” in a way different from just about everybody else. So if there is any point to this discussion, it should be to elucide how you understand them.
Thanks for making that clear to me. I don’t like the idea of having inconstent terminology usage to everyone else, so in that case I’m at deep fault. A few minutes (hours?) ago I had a moment of clarity and I’m pretty sure I’m psychotic right now. I caught myself out in the delusion I’ve been having for a couple of days, which I have had in the past for unfortunately far longer, that society and economies are going to collapse and we’re going to be forced to farm or raid people and because I’m passive and shit at gardening I’ll die a horrible death. Which, I should have good reason to believe is absurd because economic collapses are extremely rare, highly unlikely in developed countries like ours, there are measures in place to intervene in food security crises, so on and so forthe. The point is, this is consistent my prolific shit posting over the last half-day which I will probably go back and perhaps get rid of the ones without comments. Meanwhile, this thread is probably going to be extremely interesting to me when I recover from this because it formalises how it captures, to some extent how I’ve been relating to the world. To some extent I miss that if I had managed to reply to your comment further into this state it might have been very interesting. On the other hand, perhaps if not for it, I wouldn’t have recognised that this indeed is a problem right now and my delusion isn’t just a single odd piece of psychosis admist normal thinking otherwise. Ok I better get off this thing and figure out to get some help so my assignments can still be submitted in time...I’ve lost so much karma in the last half day haha.
Unless this is some kind of self-doubt, or worry/anxiety thing and I’m just making a feel of myself to refuse actually updating my beliefs faced with compelling reason. I don’t know, I feel very odd. I’ll probably update this at some point. Unless something goes very wrong...a little while ago I was thinking of retiring this account and also how interesting it would be if someone wrote a suicide note on lesswrong. Ok I need to stop right now, this isn’t right or relevant. Bye.
“Impossible is just a big word thrown around by small men who find it easier to live in the world they’ve been given than to explore the power they have to change it. Impossible is not a fact. It’s an opinion. Impossible is not a declaration. It’s a dare. Impossible is potential. Impossible is temporary. Impossible is nothing.”
It is definitely true that this could be someone’s subjective probability, if he he doesn’t understand the statement.
But if you do understand it, a thing which is logically impossible doesn’t exist, so the probability that a thing doesn’t exist will be equal to or higher than the probability that it is logically impossible.
I feel like I might understand now. Can I represent your points as follows:
all instances of things which are logically impossible also don’t exist
therefore, there are more things which don’t exist than those that are logically impossible
Assuming statement 1 is correct, without accepting a further premise I don’t feel compelled to accept the second premise. It sounds like things which are logically impossible may in fact be equivelant to things which don’t exist, and vice-versa. And that sounds intuitively compelling. If something was logically possible, it would happen. If it is wasn’t possible, it’s not going to happen. Or, the agent’s modelling of the world is wrong.
Importantly, I don’t accept premise 1, as I’ve indicated in another comment reply (something about how I find I’m wrong about the apparent impossibility of something, or possibility of something.)
A purple dog with octopus arms is logically possible, but does not exist.
I said “so the probability that a thing doesn’t exist will be equal to or higher than etc.” exactly because the probability would be equal if non-existence and logical impossibility turned out to be equivalent.
If you don’t agree that no logically impossible thing exists, then of course you might disagree with this probability assignment.
Well, the conclusion should read not “more things” but “at least as many”. Things might accidentally not exist.
I feel the fact that you reject premise 1 just means that you don’t really grasp the concept of impossibility, logical or otherwise… Or you have a different concept of existence.
The reason why I used a semi-formal notation was to suggest that if you formalise it all, you can actually prove “P(x doesn’t exist) ≥ P(x is impossible)” as a tautology. (Ignoring the issue that with specifically logical impossibility, you get into a bit of trouble with probability assignments to tautologies.)
Seems undecidable, circa Godel bla bla bla.
Uhm, what? Why? Bla bla bla indeed. (Sorry, I couldn’t resist.) It’s not actually very relevant.
If you don’t believe that logical (or, for that matter, any other sort of) impossibility implies non-existence, then you are understanding either “logical impossibility” or “non-existence” in a way different from just about everybody else. So if there is any point to this discussion, it should be to elucide how you understand them.
Thanks for making that clear to me. I don’t like the idea of having inconstent terminology usage to everyone else, so in that case I’m at deep fault. A few minutes (hours?) ago I had a moment of clarity and I’m pretty sure I’m psychotic right now. I caught myself out in the delusion I’ve been having for a couple of days, which I have had in the past for unfortunately far longer, that society and economies are going to collapse and we’re going to be forced to farm or raid people and because I’m passive and shit at gardening I’ll die a horrible death. Which, I should have good reason to believe is absurd because economic collapses are extremely rare, highly unlikely in developed countries like ours, there are measures in place to intervene in food security crises, so on and so forthe. The point is, this is consistent my prolific shit posting over the last half-day which I will probably go back and perhaps get rid of the ones without comments. Meanwhile, this thread is probably going to be extremely interesting to me when I recover from this because it formalises how it captures, to some extent how I’ve been relating to the world. To some extent I miss that if I had managed to reply to your comment further into this state it might have been very interesting. On the other hand, perhaps if not for it, I wouldn’t have recognised that this indeed is a problem right now and my delusion isn’t just a single odd piece of psychosis admist normal thinking otherwise. Ok I better get off this thing and figure out to get some help so my assignments can still be submitted in time...I’ve lost so much karma in the last half day haha.
Unless this is some kind of self-doubt, or worry/anxiety thing and I’m just making a feel of myself to refuse actually updating my beliefs faced with compelling reason. I don’t know, I feel very odd. I’ll probably update this at some point. Unless something goes very wrong...a little while ago I was thinking of retiring this account and also how interesting it would be if someone wrote a suicide note on lesswrong. Ok I need to stop right now, this isn’t right or relevant. Bye.