I think you’re correct to note that many of the responses to the original thread (including mine) were uncompelling. I also think you’re absolutely right that merchants (and customers) should continue to examine the transactions they’re participating in, and to look for ways to reduce both monetary and non-monetary costs which don’t benefit the participants.
I hadn’t examined my reaction, before responding with some canned obejctions. My real objection (I think; I’m flawed and can’t always understand my own motivations. I can definitely say that this kind of argument really bugs me) is to the oversimplification of the model and attempt to other-optimize a game in which you have no skin.
On one part of the essay, you’re so correct that you’re late to the game: there are LOTS of reserved-seat theaters, which often cost more, and they are EXCELLENT choices for those who value their time and guaranteed good seat more than the money.
I pretty much only go to non-reserved theaters for late-in-the-run and unpopular showings, where I expect the theater to be at least half-empty, so I can show up roughly on time and still get decent seats. And I recognize that I’m atypical on many dimensions, and don’t begrudge those who prefer to wait in line to get possibly-bad seats so they can see things earlier in the run without the planning and commitment of buying tickets weeks earlier.
On another topic (complaining that the theaters even HAVE bad seats), you’re simply wrong. Someone is willing to pay for those seats, sometimes. They don’t cost the theater ANYTHING to keep, and they don’t force anyone to sit there, so it’s a pure positive value when someone chooses to use that option. Even if very few people actually use those seats, there’s some menu-option value in making people feel better about the seats they DO use, because they can more easily compare to the ones they don’t. That’s _really_ hard to measure, but leaving it out of your model is a mistake.
On a different level (complaining about someone else’s business model), I find it painful to see someone with no skin in the game telling a someone that they’re stupidly failing to optimize the world, when any unproven change carries a risk of even more destruction (in terms of having to close the business entirely). Perceived risk of change is something that we just can’t wave away. Posts that attempt to analyze a “failing” in an institution which don’t sympathize with the fears and risks of committed participants (who live and die by it, like owners and managers) and only focus on the convenience of casual participants (moviegoers), even if casuals outnumber committeds by a lot, are usually missing some very key points.
Note: I _ALSO_ think that for a whole lot of people, it’s incorrect to assume statistical altruistic motivation. Many theater owners _are_ jerks who are willing to burn the world to make an extra buck. Many moviegoers will take advantage of any loophole to pay less to get good seats at a heavily-contended showing. Figuring out mechanisms to optimize welfare within these motivational constraints requires more complicated models.
This may be approximately true, but I don’t think it’s obvious and uncomplicated.
According to the googling I did on the last post, the price to the theatre of showing a film goes up with the number of seats. It’s banded, so unless they’re near the bottom of a band, removing those seats will have no marginal effect on that. And we’d expect them to cluster near the tops of bands.
But I can imagine other things it might have an effect on: ad revenue, trailer prices (I think they have to pay to show them, but I’m not sure), insurance prices, weird corporate manoeuvring (if we increase our seat count by 5%, we’ll be able to negotiate a better deal).
I think you’re correct to note that many of the responses to the original thread (including mine) were uncompelling. I also think you’re absolutely right that merchants (and customers) should continue to examine the transactions they’re participating in, and to look for ways to reduce both monetary and non-monetary costs which don’t benefit the participants.
I hadn’t examined my reaction, before responding with some canned obejctions. My real objection (I think; I’m flawed and can’t always understand my own motivations. I can definitely say that this kind of argument really bugs me) is to the oversimplification of the model and attempt to other-optimize a game in which you have no skin.
On one part of the essay, you’re so correct that you’re late to the game: there are LOTS of reserved-seat theaters, which often cost more, and they are EXCELLENT choices for those who value their time and guaranteed good seat more than the money.
I pretty much only go to non-reserved theaters for late-in-the-run and unpopular showings, where I expect the theater to be at least half-empty, so I can show up roughly on time and still get decent seats. And I recognize that I’m atypical on many dimensions, and don’t begrudge those who prefer to wait in line to get possibly-bad seats so they can see things earlier in the run without the planning and commitment of buying tickets weeks earlier.
On another topic (complaining that the theaters even HAVE bad seats), you’re simply wrong. Someone is willing to pay for those seats, sometimes. They don’t cost the theater ANYTHING to keep, and they don’t force anyone to sit there, so it’s a pure positive value when someone chooses to use that option. Even if very few people actually use those seats, there’s some menu-option value in making people feel better about the seats they DO use, because they can more easily compare to the ones they don’t. That’s _really_ hard to measure, but leaving it out of your model is a mistake.
On a different level (complaining about someone else’s business model), I find it painful to see someone with no skin in the game telling a someone that they’re stupidly failing to optimize the world, when any unproven change carries a risk of even more destruction (in terms of having to close the business entirely). Perceived risk of change is something that we just can’t wave away. Posts that attempt to analyze a “failing” in an institution which don’t sympathize with the fears and risks of committed participants (who live and die by it, like owners and managers) and only focus on the convenience of casual participants (moviegoers), even if casuals outnumber committeds by a lot, are usually missing some very key points.
Note: I _ALSO_ think that for a whole lot of people, it’s incorrect to assume statistical altruistic motivation. Many theater owners _are_ jerks who are willing to burn the world to make an extra buck. Many moviegoers will take advantage of any loophole to pay less to get good seats at a heavily-contended showing. Figuring out mechanisms to optimize welfare within these motivational constraints requires more complicated models.
This may be approximately true, but I don’t think it’s obvious and uncomplicated.
According to the googling I did on the last post, the price to the theatre of showing a film goes up with the number of seats. It’s banded, so unless they’re near the bottom of a band, removing those seats will have no marginal effect on that. And we’d expect them to cluster near the tops of bands.
But I can imagine other things it might have an effect on: ad revenue, trailer prices (I think they have to pay to show them, but I’m not sure), insurance prices, weird corporate manoeuvring (if we increase our seat count by 5%, we’ll be able to negotiate a better deal).