Faint memory: didn’t they have a statue in plate armor?
Yup. For that matter, Sir Cadogan is fairly unambiguously described as a mounted knight.
On the other hand, I’m not sure how this project is to be reliably carried out without knowing what wizards could have invented for themselves—or, indeed, how far back the separation between the two societies goes historically. I’ll give you the train, certainly, but on the other hand:
They celebrate Christmas.
Early Christianity may have existed before Muggle and wizard societies separated. It may have had both wizard and Muggle worshippers (Rowling is silent on the matter of religion, but resurrection would be just as miraculous to wizards). For that matter, Jesus could have existed in the Potterverse, in which case odds of him being a wizard are extremely high.
IIRC, they use the Roman alphabet, or at least I don’t remember British muggle students having to learn a different alphabet.
The Muggle and wizard communities are tightly bound enough to maintain the same language (they share the same geographical territory, and intermarriage is not uncommon). Assuming that, at some point in the past, wizardry emerged from a Muggle population, there’s no reason why the two should not share the same linguistic evolution.
Their spells show an influence from Latin.
Which suggests the existence of Roman wizards, supporting the above point.
Hogwarts resembles a British public school.
Fair point. Although I struggle to come up with a mechanism by which nearly-modern Muggle teaching practices should come to be adopted by a school founded nearly a millennium earlier by wizarding purebloods, and maintained in a highly conservative fashion. If anything, one might speculate that British public schools are influenced by Hogwarts.
They speak English, even if words relating to technology and science are absent.
See above.
They use a train.
No contest. Ditto the printing press. I think our best bet may be to look at technologies which wizards would not have developed on their own (e.g. in that no other standard wizarding form of transport we know remotely resembles a train, or something which could evolve into a train). But that’s a much more limited list.
Jesus in Potterverse, as a wizard who experimented with turning squib-disciples into wizards so he could eventually do the same with all muggles and be their king. His blood in wine-potions and flesh in bread-potions only gave the recipients as much magic as went into creating those body parts, allowing the occasional “miracle”.
Decades after this story, Draco and his Science Eaters isolate and replicate the magic genes and start making potions that turn muggles and squibs into wizards (but also marks them in a way they can’t see, for … research, and to give them extra power), and use their huge army of new wizards and noble and blood purist allies everywhere to conquer the world. Hermione leads a resistance force of the best trained wizards alive to stop them. Harry discovers that Draco’s mark sets in too soon before the transformation to wizard is complete, becoming fatal within a few years in ~90% of cases, which Draco considers an acceptable risk to become a wizard. And that it bends their will to Draco’s. So Harry, the elite Bayesian Conspiracy, and the Chaos Legion, formed from anyone/anything else that would fight, fight to remove the mark, stop Hermione’s people from killing new wizards before they’ve been freed and had a chance to choose their own actions, distribute a potion that doesn’t fatally mark new wizards, and protect the new wizards without the mark, who are about as powerful as third-years.
The rise in wizard creation and deaths triggers the end of Jesus’s stasis spell, and he analyzes the situation, gathers Harry, Hermione, and Draco together, and tells Harry to divide a third of his troops between Draco’s and Hermione’s armies, to make it fair. Hermione dies.
The rise in wizard creation and deaths triggers the end of Jesus’s stasis spell, and he analyzes the situation, gathers Harry, Hermione, and Draco together, and tells Harry to divide a third of his troops between Draco’s and Hermione’s armies, to make it fair.
Early Christianity may have existed before Muggle and wizard societies separated. It may have had both wizard and Muggle worshippers (Rowling is silent on the matter of religion, but resurrection would be just as miraculous to wizards). For that matter, Jesus could have existed in the Potterverse, in which case odds of him being a wizard are extremely high.
Early Christians did not have a tradition regarding a fat, bearded man commemorating the birth of their savior by giving gifts to good children.
Nor do we know that wizards have one. We know that people give each other presents at Christmas. We also know that there is a wizard explanation for the hanging of green and red decorations. Are there any other features of Muggle Christmas that show up in canon?
Personally, I think Eliezer keeping the train- qua train- is a mistake. It shows too much influence from the muggle universe. I mean, what did Hogwarts use as soon as 200 years ago? Why would they change it given their extremely conservative world-view? A Eberron-style lightning train would be more plausible.
Eliezer also has magical pop-top soda cans. I think he’s just keeping it as random and nonsensical as canon, which to me accurately maps the way cultures bleed into one another.
Yes, understatement. I’m not sure what probability you should have attached.
They celebrate Christmas.
It’s possible that they invented scrolls for themselves, but I’m not counting on it.
IIRC, they use the Roman alphabet, or at least I don’t remember British muggle students having to learn a different alphabet.
Their spells show an influence from Latin.
Hogwarts resembles a British public school.
They speak English, even if words relating to technology and science are absent.
They use a train.
Faint memory: didn’t they have a statue in plate armor?
Clothing.
Crockery.
Shelters, both portable and permanent (masonry, carpentry, and textile)
Prepared foods (despite divergence).
Eye glasses.
The custom of men shaving their faces
The custom of women being more likely than men to have long hair (not actually sure about this one for adults, but it seems to apply to the children)
Theater.
It is a difficult thing to make a complete list. Days later I’m sure I’ll have twenty more if I didn’t hear of a better puzzle.
Yup. For that matter, Sir Cadogan is fairly unambiguously described as a mounted knight.
On the other hand, I’m not sure how this project is to be reliably carried out without knowing what wizards could have invented for themselves—or, indeed, how far back the separation between the two societies goes historically. I’ll give you the train, certainly, but on the other hand:
Early Christianity may have existed before Muggle and wizard societies separated. It may have had both wizard and Muggle worshippers (Rowling is silent on the matter of religion, but resurrection would be just as miraculous to wizards). For that matter, Jesus could have existed in the Potterverse, in which case odds of him being a wizard are extremely high.
The Muggle and wizard communities are tightly bound enough to maintain the same language (they share the same geographical territory, and intermarriage is not uncommon). Assuming that, at some point in the past, wizardry emerged from a Muggle population, there’s no reason why the two should not share the same linguistic evolution.
Which suggests the existence of Roman wizards, supporting the above point.
Fair point. Although I struggle to come up with a mechanism by which nearly-modern Muggle teaching practices should come to be adopted by a school founded nearly a millennium earlier by wizarding purebloods, and maintained in a highly conservative fashion. If anything, one might speculate that British public schools are influenced by Hogwarts.
See above.
No contest. Ditto the printing press. I think our best bet may be to look at technologies which wizards would not have developed on their own (e.g. in that no other standard wizarding form of transport we know remotely resembles a train, or something which could evolve into a train). But that’s a much more limited list.
Jesus in Potterverse, as a wizard who experimented with turning squib-disciples into wizards so he could eventually do the same with all muggles and be their king. His blood in wine-potions and flesh in bread-potions only gave the recipients as much magic as went into creating those body parts, allowing the occasional “miracle”.
Decades after this story, Draco and his Science Eaters isolate and replicate the magic genes and start making potions that turn muggles and squibs into wizards (but also marks them in a way they can’t see, for … research, and to give them extra power), and use their huge army of new wizards and noble and blood purist allies everywhere to conquer the world. Hermione leads a resistance force of the best trained wizards alive to stop them. Harry discovers that Draco’s mark sets in too soon before the transformation to wizard is complete, becoming fatal within a few years in ~90% of cases, which Draco considers an acceptable risk to become a wizard. And that it bends their will to Draco’s. So Harry, the elite Bayesian Conspiracy, and the Chaos Legion, formed from anyone/anything else that would fight, fight to remove the mark, stop Hermione’s people from killing new wizards before they’ve been freed and had a chance to choose their own actions, distribute a potion that doesn’t fatally mark new wizards, and protect the new wizards without the mark, who are about as powerful as third-years.
The rise in wizard creation and deaths triggers the end of Jesus’s stasis spell, and he analyzes the situation, gathers Harry, Hermione, and Draco together, and tells Harry to divide a third of his troops between Draco’s and Hermione’s armies, to make it fair. Hermione dies.
Upvoted for this part.
Thanks. The middle paragraph was far too predictable and mundane to exist without the proper punchline.
Wow, now I sorta want to write this… well, the first paragraph anyway. BIBLE/POTTER CROSSOVERS!
Early Christians did not have a tradition regarding a fat, bearded man commemorating the birth of their savior by giving gifts to good children.
Nor do we know that wizards have one. We know that people give each other presents at Christmas. We also know that there is a wizard explanation for the hanging of green and red decorations. Are there any other features of Muggle Christmas that show up in canon?
Decorated Christmas trees, mistletoe hanging from the ceiling… And the ‘wizard explanation’ for red and green is MoR-only, of course.
If it’s not already in other fanfics by now, it will be soon.
Father Christmas, isn’t it? Or Santa Claus. That’s canon.
Is it? I can’t remember. The only Santa Claus reference that springs to mind is the signature on the notes in MoR.
Personally, I think Eliezer keeping the train- qua train- is a mistake. It shows too much influence from the muggle universe. I mean, what did Hogwarts use as soon as 200 years ago? Why would they change it given their extremely conservative world-view? A Eberron-style lightning train would be more plausible.
Eliezer also has magical pop-top soda cans. I think he’s just keeping it as random and nonsensical as canon, which to me accurately maps the way cultures bleed into one another.