I made that same criticism to Robin Hanson, that the cells in an organism don’t seem to have that kind of trouble, but within-organism coordination is clearly at least somewhat imperfect, considering that many animals do end up developing cancer during their lifetime. And I certainly have no idea what kinds of costs the body’s various anti-cancer mechanisms end up imposing.
Yes, but we understand that cancer is a ‘disposable soma’ tradeoff, and that there are large, complex organisms that never get cancer. So any idea that cancer-like effects will necessarily prevent large-scale coordination seems pretty ridiculous. If empires get cancer, it will be because they are prepared to pay the costs of chopping out the occasional tumor. There are some costs to coordination, but it isn’t that hard. Even ants manage it.
there are large, complex organisms that never get cancer.
Well, I know that plants don’t get cancer the same way animals do, but it’s even possible for insects to get cancer, although they don’t usually live long enough to accumulate enough mutations to produce a tumor. Which complex organisms in particular did you have in mind? (“Sharks don’t get cancer” is a myth invented by people who were trying to make money by selling shark cartilage.)
Well, as Robin Hanson said, coordination is hard.
It seems easy enough—among close relatives. Check out eucaryotic cells, for instance.
We might not all be genetically related—but we could easily become more memetically related.
I made that same criticism to Robin Hanson, that the cells in an organism don’t seem to have that kind of trouble, but within-organism coordination is clearly at least somewhat imperfect, considering that many animals do end up developing cancer during their lifetime. And I certainly have no idea what kinds of costs the body’s various anti-cancer mechanisms end up imposing.
Yes, but we understand that cancer is a ‘disposable soma’ tradeoff, and that there are large, complex organisms that never get cancer. So any idea that cancer-like effects will necessarily prevent large-scale coordination seems pretty ridiculous. If empires get cancer, it will be because they are prepared to pay the costs of chopping out the occasional tumor. There are some costs to coordination, but it isn’t that hard. Even ants manage it.
Well, I know that plants don’t get cancer the same way animals do, but it’s even possible for insects to get cancer, although they don’t usually live long enough to accumulate enough mutations to produce a tumor. Which complex organisms in particular did you have in mind? (“Sharks don’t get cancer” is a myth invented by people who were trying to make money by selling shark cartilage.)
Engineered mice, naked mole rats.