So it might be the case that bayesian updating has some quirky memetic mutation that could lead it to destroy itself if it stopped working. Maybe so-called ‘rationalism’ is especially bad at absorbing internal contradictions. But this would be a feature of they belief itself—not a feature of it being a belief about procedure. Many beliefs about procedure are exactly the opposite—take believing that truth can be taken from the Bible. That procedure is self-justifying and there is no way to dispute it from within the assumptions of the procedure.
Mostly, I just don’t think the distinction you are trying to make between “procedural” and “substantive” beliefs holds water. Beliefs about political theory and economics, for example, are almost all procedural beliefs (i.e. the right procedure for making a law or stimulating the economy). What about them would make them immune to labeling problems?
“Many beliefs about procedure are exactly the opposite—take believing that truth can be taken from the Bible. That procedure is self-justifying and there is no way to dispute it from within the assumptions of the procedure.”
That’s my point about rationality—the way I think about it, it would catch its own contradictions. In essence, a rationalist would recognize that rationalists don’t “win.” So as a result, committing yourself to rationality doesn’t actually commit you to an outcome, as perhaps following a scripture would.
The bigger problem, I believe, is that most professed commitment to a procedure is superficial, and that instead most people simply bend the procedure to a preferred outcome. “The Devil may cite scripture for his purpose.” The key, of course, is following the procedure accurately, and this is the community that’ll keep you in line if you try to bend procedure to your preferred conclusion.
“So as a result, committing yourself to rationality doesn’t actually commit you to an outcome, as perhaps following a scripture would.”
Doesn’t committing yourself to rationality commit you to the outcome that so and so “will be rational”? I’m not saying that this is the same exact thing as what evangelical christians do, where they actually twist the lines to reason to their preferred conclusion. But it’s like Jack said, don’t dupe yourself into thinking none of the problems with labeling will apply to you. That’s where you get into a tricky place, because you are ignoring a piece of information that does not jibe with your preferred view of yourself.
So it might be the case that bayesian updating has some quirky memetic mutation that could lead it to destroy itself if it stopped working. Maybe so-called ‘rationalism’ is especially bad at absorbing internal contradictions. But this would be a feature of they belief itself—not a feature of it being a belief about procedure. Many beliefs about procedure are exactly the opposite—take believing that truth can be taken from the Bible. That procedure is self-justifying and there is no way to dispute it from within the assumptions of the procedure.
Mostly, I just don’t think the distinction you are trying to make between “procedural” and “substantive” beliefs holds water. Beliefs about political theory and economics, for example, are almost all procedural beliefs (i.e. the right procedure for making a law or stimulating the economy). What about them would make them immune to labeling problems?
“Many beliefs about procedure are exactly the opposite—take believing that truth can be taken from the Bible. That procedure is self-justifying and there is no way to dispute it from within the assumptions of the procedure.”
That’s my point about rationality—the way I think about it, it would catch its own contradictions. In essence, a rationalist would recognize that rationalists don’t “win.” So as a result, committing yourself to rationality doesn’t actually commit you to an outcome, as perhaps following a scripture would.
The bigger problem, I believe, is that most professed commitment to a procedure is superficial, and that instead most people simply bend the procedure to a preferred outcome. “The Devil may cite scripture for his purpose.” The key, of course, is following the procedure accurately, and this is the community that’ll keep you in line if you try to bend procedure to your preferred conclusion.
“So as a result, committing yourself to rationality doesn’t actually commit you to an outcome, as perhaps following a scripture would.”
Doesn’t committing yourself to rationality commit you to the outcome that so and so “will be rational”? I’m not saying that this is the same exact thing as what evangelical christians do, where they actually twist the lines to reason to their preferred conclusion. But it’s like Jack said, don’t dupe yourself into thinking none of the problems with labeling will apply to you. That’s where you get into a tricky place, because you are ignoring a piece of information that does not jibe with your preferred view of yourself.