This essay’s thesis is that we should eat less meat, but its evidence is only that factory-farmed meat is a problem.
Most (but not all) of the meat I eat is not factory-farmed. The coop where I buy my meat says (pdf) that it buys only “humanely and sustainably raised” meat and poultry … from animals that are free to range on chemical-free pastures, raised on a grass-based diet with quality grain used only as necessary, never given hormones and produced and processed by small-scale farmers.” (For eggs, the coop does offer less-humane options, but I only buy the most-humane ones).
I might stop eating most of the factory-farmed meat that I eat. It would simply mean never eating out at non-frou-frou places. The exception would be dealing with non-local family (for local family, I could simply bring meat from the coop to share).
That said, it’s hard to know when a restaurant is serving humanely raised meat. It seems like it would be nice to have a site where I could type in a restaurant’s name, and find out who their suppliers are and what standards they adhere to. For the vast majority of restaurants, the answer would be that they just don’t care. But, at least in NYC, it’s common for foodie sorts of restaurants to list their suppliers. My favorite restaurant, Momofuku, for instance, sometimes specifically lists that some dish’s meat is from e.g. Niman Ranch. Niman Ranch claims to raise their animals humanely. Do they really? And such a site would increase the pressure on restaurants to choose humane suppliers.
Niman Ranch claims to raise their animals humanely. Do they really?
The shareholders of Niman Ranch voted to reduce their standards to increase profits. As a result, Bill Niman (who originally founded the company) now refuses to eat their products, Wikipedia has more
This essay’s thesis is that we should eat less meat, but its evidence is only that factory-farmed meat is a problem.
I only think factory-farmed meat is the problem. I use “eat less meat” as a shorthand, since nearly all meat is factory-farmed meat.
~
The coop where I buy my meat says (pdf) that it buys only “humanely and sustainably raised” meat and poultry
I definitely agree it’s better to buy “humanely raised” meat and poultry than not “humanely raised” meat/poultry. And perhaps you have found a trustworthy source.
But be careful of why I put “humanely raised” in quotes—many such operations are not actually humane. Cage-free is much better than not cage-free, but conditions are still pretty bad. Free-range is better than not free-range, but just legally requires the animal be allowed to stay outside. There are no legal restrictions on the quality of the outside section, how long they can stay outside, or crowding. Vegan Outreach has more information.
~
I might stop eating most of the factory-farmed meat that I eat. It would simply mean never eating out at non-frou-frou places. The exception would be dealing with non-local family (for local family, I could simply bring meat from the coop to share).
I was going to ask what you thought about http://www.certifiedhumane.com/ but it is completely fucking useless: “The Animal Care Standards for Chickens Used in Broiler Production do not require that chickens have access to range.” So nevermind.
So instead I’ll ask why a meaningful set of standards doesn’t exist. http://www.globalanimalpartnership.org/ Step 5, maybe? Their web site sucks, because it doesn’t give me a searchable list of products, but maybe they just need some help.
Anyway, this seems like it would be a way more effective thing for EAA to do than just about anything else—I bet lots more people would be willing to pay more for meat, than would be convinceable to eat less meat directly.
Anyway, this seems like it would be a way more effective thing for EAA to do than just about anything else—I bet lots more people would be willing to pay more for meat, than would be convinceable to eat less meat directly.
That sounds like it could be a good idea. One immediate problem I see with this is that most consumers wouldn’t be able to distinguish EAA’s label from the dozens of nearly-meaningless labels such as “Free Range”, “Cage-Free”, etc.
How much of that is US-specific? According to defra:
Stocking rate in the house is as follows: … Chickens = 13 birds but not more than 27.5 kg live weight per m²;
“the birds have had during at least half their lifetime continuous daytime access to open-air runs, comprising an area mainly covered by vegetation, of not less than:
1m² per chicken or guinea fowl (in the case of guinea fowls, open-air runs may be replaced by a perchery having a floor space of at least that of the house and a height of at least 2m, with perches of at least 10 cm length available per bird in total (house and perchery)).
I only think factory-farmed meat is the problem. I use “eat less meat” as a shorthand, since nearly all meat is factory-farmed meat.
Factory-farmed meat converts photosynthetic energy (grass) to food much more efficiently than free-range farming. Factory farming requires less inputs in terms of arable land and water, and emits less CO2. If everyone in the world ate non-factory farmed meat, we would have to cut down the Amazon many times over, thereby drastically reducing earth’s capacity to convert CO2 back to carbohydrates.
When you decide whether your meat should be factory farmed or not, , there are consequences on two scales that are negatively correlated: Animal welfare and global warming. Which of these scales you give most weight to, will depend on your prior for anthropogenic global warming, on your beliefs about the consequences of global warming, and on the priority you give animals in your aggregation scheme over individuals with moral standing.
A source is “Allison, Richard. “Organic chicken production criticised for leaving a larger carbon footprint.” Poultry World. 1 Mar. 2007”. This article is behind a paywall. I am pasting a table from the article:
AVERAGE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT FROM POULTRY PRODUCTION (% DIFFERENCE TO CONVENTIONAL)
Organic Free range
Energy use +33% +25%
Global warming potential (CO2) +46% +20%
Eutrophication potential +75% +28%
Acidification potential +52% +33%
Pesticide use (dose/ha) −92% +12%
Note: This article is in a trade publication and could be biased. It is based on an original report which I could not locate, and which apparently has sparse data. Obviously, more research is needed.
My prior beliefs are not the result of scientific studies, but follow from the following observations:
(1) To reduce global warming, we need to maximize the number of calories produced per unit of CO2 emission
(2) The most effective way we can alter that ratio, is by reducing the amount of biochemical energy that is used to power the biochemical processes of farm animals over the course of their lives. This is primarily a function of duration of their lives.
(3) Factory farming achieves shorter duration, by having the animals grow more quickly
(4) Another way we can reduce the net amount of CO2 produced per unit food, is by reducing the amount of land used, thus allowing less deforestation.
(5) Factory farming achieves this by using less land
(6) I cannot see any other mechanisms that differ between factory farming and organic farming which would have a major net effect on the carbon cycle.
How much value would this conversion have relative to vegetarianism?
For example, I recently changed to only buying grass-fed beef (in part for health/taste reasons); how much humane value would you think that has relative to replacing my beef with whatever else?
What about replacing eggs with cage free or free range eggs versus a vegan replacement?
The value seems obviously positive, but it’s going to be very unclear as to what the exact value is. On a pure suffering per kg of meat basis, whatever you’re doing with chicken welfare is going to dominate. I expect cage free / free range to be moderately better than still eating regular eggs, but not eating eggs to be perhaps like 3x better, relatively.
There are no legal restrictions … how long they can stay outside
That’s not quite what the source (beware, unpleasant images) says;
No other requirements—such as … the amount of time spent outdoors … are specified
An animal that is allowed to go outside every day, but always chooses not to, satisfies the latter but not the former. Which is actually the case? Moreover, these are very morally distinct! People who are forced to stay in a cell are prisoners; people who choose to stay in a cell are recluses.
This essay’s thesis is that we should eat less meat, but its evidence is only that factory-farmed meat is a problem.
Most (but not all) of the meat I eat is not factory-farmed. The coop where I buy my meat says (pdf) that it buys only “humanely and sustainably raised” meat and poultry … from animals that are free to range on chemical-free pastures, raised on a grass-based diet with quality grain used only as necessary, never given hormones and produced and processed by small-scale farmers.” (For eggs, the coop does offer less-humane options, but I only buy the most-humane ones).
I might stop eating most of the factory-farmed meat that I eat. It would simply mean never eating out at non-frou-frou places. The exception would be dealing with non-local family (for local family, I could simply bring meat from the coop to share).
That said, it’s hard to know when a restaurant is serving humanely raised meat. It seems like it would be nice to have a site where I could type in a restaurant’s name, and find out who their suppliers are and what standards they adhere to. For the vast majority of restaurants, the answer would be that they just don’t care. But, at least in NYC, it’s common for foodie sorts of restaurants to list their suppliers. My favorite restaurant, Momofuku, for instance, sometimes specifically lists that some dish’s meat is from e.g. Niman Ranch. Niman Ranch claims to raise their animals humanely. Do they really? And such a site would increase the pressure on restaurants to choose humane suppliers.
The shareholders of Niman Ranch voted to reduce their standards to increase profits. As a result, Bill Niman (who originally founded the company) now refuses to eat their products, Wikipedia has more
I only think factory-farmed meat is the problem. I use “eat less meat” as a shorthand, since nearly all meat is factory-farmed meat.
~
I definitely agree it’s better to buy “humanely raised” meat and poultry than not “humanely raised” meat/poultry. And perhaps you have found a trustworthy source.
But be careful of why I put “humanely raised” in quotes—many such operations are not actually humane. Cage-free is much better than not cage-free, but conditions are still pretty bad. Free-range is better than not free-range, but just legally requires the animal be allowed to stay outside. There are no legal restrictions on the quality of the outside section, how long they can stay outside, or crowding. Vegan Outreach has more information.
~
That sounds like an excellent idea!
I was going to ask what you thought about http://www.certifiedhumane.com/ but it is completely fucking useless: “The Animal Care Standards for Chickens Used in Broiler Production do not require that chickens have access to range.” So nevermind.
So instead I’ll ask why a meaningful set of standards doesn’t exist. http://www.globalanimalpartnership.org/ Step 5, maybe? Their web site sucks, because it doesn’t give me a searchable list of products, but maybe they just need some help.
Anyway, this seems like it would be a way more effective thing for EAA to do than just about anything else—I bet lots more people would be willing to pay more for meat, than would be convinceable to eat less meat directly.
That sounds like it could be a good idea. One immediate problem I see with this is that most consumers wouldn’t be able to distinguish EAA’s label from the dozens of nearly-meaningless labels such as “Free Range”, “Cage-Free”, etc.
It would take a serious marketing campaign. But Givewell seems to be increasingly popular—they would probably promote a well-designed program.
How much of that is US-specific? According to defra:
source
Factory-farmed meat converts photosynthetic energy (grass) to food much more efficiently than free-range farming. Factory farming requires less inputs in terms of arable land and water, and emits less CO2. If everyone in the world ate non-factory farmed meat, we would have to cut down the Amazon many times over, thereby drastically reducing earth’s capacity to convert CO2 back to carbohydrates.
When you decide whether your meat should be factory farmed or not, , there are consequences on two scales that are negatively correlated: Animal welfare and global warming. Which of these scales you give most weight to, will depend on your prior for anthropogenic global warming, on your beliefs about the consequences of global warming, and on the priority you give animals in your aggregation scheme over individuals with moral standing.
Modern farming techniques are designed to minimize labor, especially managerial labor, not energy.
Factory-farmed animals don’t eat grass. This is a really important detail.
I hadn’t considered that. Do you have any sources for your claims?
Personally, I don’t eat meat of any type, so this wouldn’t be a problem for my diet.
A source is “Allison, Richard. “Organic chicken production criticised for leaving a larger carbon footprint.” Poultry World. 1 Mar. 2007”. This article is behind a paywall. I am pasting a table from the article:
AVERAGE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT FROM POULTRY PRODUCTION (% DIFFERENCE TO CONVENTIONAL) Organic Free range
Energy use +33% +25%
Global warming potential (CO2) +46% +20%
Eutrophication potential +75% +28%
Acidification potential +52% +33%
Pesticide use (dose/ha) −92% +12%
Note: This article is in a trade publication and could be biased. It is based on an original report which I could not locate, and which apparently has sparse data. Obviously, more research is needed.
My prior beliefs are not the result of scientific studies, but follow from the following observations:
(1) To reduce global warming, we need to maximize the number of calories produced per unit of CO2 emission
(2) The most effective way we can alter that ratio, is by reducing the amount of biochemical energy that is used to power the biochemical processes of farm animals over the course of their lives. This is primarily a function of duration of their lives.
(3) Factory farming achieves shorter duration, by having the animals grow more quickly
(4) Another way we can reduce the net amount of CO2 produced per unit food, is by reducing the amount of land used, thus allowing less deforestation.
(5) Factory farming achieves this by using less land
(6) I cannot see any other mechanisms that differ between factory farming and organic farming which would have a major net effect on the carbon cycle.
How much value would this conversion have relative to vegetarianism?
For example, I recently changed to only buying grass-fed beef (in part for health/taste reasons); how much humane value would you think that has relative to replacing my beef with whatever else?
What about replacing eggs with cage free or free range eggs versus a vegan replacement?
The value seems obviously positive, but it’s going to be very unclear as to what the exact value is. On a pure suffering per kg of meat basis, whatever you’re doing with chicken welfare is going to dominate. I expect cage free / free range to be moderately better than still eating regular eggs, but not eating eggs to be perhaps like 3x better, relatively.
That’s not quite what the source (beware, unpleasant images) says;
An animal that is allowed to go outside every day, but always chooses not to, satisfies the latter but not the former. Which is actually the case? Moreover, these are very morally distinct! People who are forced to stay in a cell are prisoners; people who choose to stay in a cell are recluses.