This article provides a bunch of possible metrics for comparing them (cited papers, audience, publicity, achievements per dollar...).
Yes, and it seems from Kaj’s data that by most of the obvious metrics, FHI is beating SI by a lot. One might think that the SI is doing well for publicity but that’s primarily through the Summits. The media coverage is clearly much larger for the FHI than the SI. Moreover, the media coverage for the summits frequently focused on Kurzweil style singularities and similar things.
The media coverage is clearly much larger for the FHI than the SI. Moreover, the media coverage for the summits frequently focused on Kurzweil style singularities and similar things.
The last Summit I was at, the previous NYC one, had an audience of close to a thousand that was relatively savvy and influential (registration records and other info show a lot of VCs, scientists, talented students, entrepreneurs and wealthy individuals) who got to see more substantive talks, even if those were not picked up as much by the media.
Also, one should apply the off-topic correction evenly: a fair amount of FHI media attention is likewise grabbing a quote on some fairly peripheral issue.
I feel like it’s to some extent an apples-to-oranges comparison. FHI is obviously doing better in terms of academic credibility, as measured by citations and their smaller academic conferences; SI seems to be doing much better in mass-audience publicity, as measured by 1 million unique visitors to LessWrong (!) and the Singularity Summit, which is growing each year and has a dramatically larger and wider audience than any FHI conferences. The Visiting Fellows program also stood out as something SI was doing much better.
but that’s primarily through the Summits.
I don’t really see why that’s a “but”. Is it because the media focuses on Kurzweilian Singularities?
I would love to see a financial analysis of FHI along the lines of this one, to evaluate the achievements/dollars metric.
But based on the metrics we have, the only one which seems decisively in FHI’s favor is citations.
This article caused me to update in favor of “FHI is the best transhumanist charity”, but only marginally so. If your interpretation was stronger than that, I’d be interested in hearing why.
I’m not I’m thinking in terms of “best transhumanist charity” which seems to be very hard to define. . I’d say more that I’m thinking in terms of something like “which of these two charities is a most efficient use of my resources, especially in regards to reducing existential risk, and encouraging the general improvement of humanity.”
If I were attempting to think about this in terms of a very broad set of “transhumanist” goals, then I’d point to the
the citations and the large number of media appearances as aspects where the FHI seems to be doing much more productively than the SI. Citations are an obviously important metric- most serious existential risk issues require academics to pay attention otherwise what you do won’t matter much. Media attention is more important in getting people to realize that a) things like death really are as bad as they seem and b) that we might be able to really do something about them.
The primary reason I haven’t updated that much in the direction of the FHI is that I don’t know how much money the FHI is using to get these results, and also how much of this would be work that academics would do anyways. (When academics become affiliated with an institution they often do work they would already do and just tweak it to fit the institutions goals a bit more.) .
Yes, and it seems from Kaj’s data that by most of the obvious metrics, FHI is beating SI by a lot. One might think that the SI is doing well for publicity but that’s primarily through the Summits. The media coverage is clearly much larger for the FHI than the SI. Moreover, the media coverage for the summits frequently focused on Kurzweil style singularities and similar things.
The last Summit I was at, the previous NYC one, had an audience of close to a thousand that was relatively savvy and influential (registration records and other info show a lot of VCs, scientists, talented students, entrepreneurs and wealthy individuals) who got to see more substantive talks, even if those were not picked up as much by the media.
Also, one should apply the off-topic correction evenly: a fair amount of FHI media attention is likewise grabbing a quote on some fairly peripheral issue.
Interesting. That seems to be a strong argument to update more towards the SI.
I feel like it’s to some extent an apples-to-oranges comparison. FHI is obviously doing better in terms of academic credibility, as measured by citations and their smaller academic conferences; SI seems to be doing much better in mass-audience publicity, as measured by 1 million unique visitors to LessWrong (!) and the Singularity Summit, which is growing each year and has a dramatically larger and wider audience than any FHI conferences. The Visiting Fellows program also stood out as something SI was doing much better.
I don’t really see why that’s a “but”. Is it because the media focuses on Kurzweilian Singularities?
I would love to see a financial analysis of FHI along the lines of this one, to evaluate the achievements/dollars metric.
But based on the metrics we have, the only one which seems decisively in FHI’s favor is citations.
This article caused me to update in favor of “FHI is the best transhumanist charity”, but only marginally so. If your interpretation was stronger than that, I’d be interested in hearing why.
I’m not I’m thinking in terms of “best transhumanist charity” which seems to be very hard to define. . I’d say more that I’m thinking in terms of something like “which of these two charities is a most efficient use of my resources, especially in regards to reducing existential risk, and encouraging the general improvement of humanity.”
If I were attempting to think about this in terms of a very broad set of “transhumanist” goals, then I’d point to the the citations and the large number of media appearances as aspects where the FHI seems to be doing much more productively than the SI. Citations are an obviously important metric- most serious existential risk issues require academics to pay attention otherwise what you do won’t matter much. Media attention is more important in getting people to realize that a) things like death really are as bad as they seem and b) that we might be able to really do something about them.
The primary reason I haven’t updated that much in the direction of the FHI is that I don’t know how much money the FHI is using to get these results, and also how much of this would be work that academics would do anyways. (When academics become affiliated with an institution they often do work they would already do and just tweak it to fit the institutions goals a bit more.) .