This way you can inquire after their exact position, why they hold that position, and without taking a side gather whether they’re open to accepting another position whilst presenting viable alternatives in a reasoned and unobtrusive fashion.
What you actually appear to be doing in this exchange is framing the debate (this is not a neutral action) under the guise of being a neutral observer. If your arguer is experienced enough to see what you’re doing, he will challenge you on it probably in a way that will result in a flame war. If he isn’t experienced enough he may see what appears to be a logical argument that somehow doesn’t seem persuasive and this may put him off the whole concept of logical arguing.
If I’m interpreting his objection correctly, I think the framing enables potential and possibly unknown biases to corrupt the entire process. The other party (parties) may consciously think they agree on a particular frame, but some buried bias or unknown belief may be incompatible with the frame, and will end up rejecting it.
Well, then they can tell you they made a mistake and actually reject the frame explaining why and you will have learned about their position allowing you to construct a new frame.
Indeed, though I wonder whether they will not themselves be able to express why often enough to warrant a complete omission of the framing step in favor of immediate hypothetical probing, and even that assumes they’ll realize the frame is inaccurate before the argument ends and each go their separate way.
So by framing their position with my own words, I could be tricking them into agreeing to something that sounds to technically be their position, while their actual position could be suppressed, unknown, and biasing their reception to all that then follows? That sounds true, however if they interject and state their position themselves, then would the technique of probing with hypotheticals also not be neutral?
I have edited the original comment so as to include and account for the former possibility, though I think the latter, probing with hypotheticals, is a valid neutral technique. If I’m wrong, please correct me.
What you actually appear to be doing in this exchange is framing the debate (this is not a neutral action) under the guise of being a neutral observer. If your arguer is experienced enough to see what you’re doing, he will challenge you on it probably in a way that will result in a flame war. If he isn’t experienced enough he may see what appears to be a logical argument that somehow doesn’t seem persuasive and this may put him off the whole concept of logical arguing.
I don’t see how it breaks neutrality if you frame the debate in a non-fallacious perspective.
Can’t it end in a peaceful back-and-forth until we have agreed on a common frame?
If I’m interpreting his objection correctly, I think the framing enables potential and possibly unknown biases to corrupt the entire process. The other party (parties) may consciously think they agree on a particular frame, but some buried bias or unknown belief may be incompatible with the frame, and will end up rejecting it.
Well, then they can tell you they made a mistake and actually reject the frame explaining why and you will have learned about their position allowing you to construct a new frame.
Indeed, though I wonder whether they will not themselves be able to express why often enough to warrant a complete omission of the framing step in favor of immediate hypothetical probing, and even that assumes they’ll realize the frame is inaccurate before the argument ends and each go their separate way.
So by framing their position with my own words, I could be tricking them into agreeing to something that sounds to technically be their position, while their actual position could be suppressed, unknown, and biasing their reception to all that then follows? That sounds true, however if they interject and state their position themselves, then would the technique of probing with hypotheticals also not be neutral?
I have edited the original comment so as to include and account for the former possibility, though I think the latter, probing with hypotheticals, is a valid neutral technique. If I’m wrong, please correct me.