While I think it’s fine to call someone out by name if nothing else is working, I think the way you’re doing it is unnecessarily antagonistic and seemingly intentionally spiteful or at least utterly un-empathetic, and what you’re doing can (and in my opinion ought to) be done empathetically, for cohesion and not hurting people excessively and whatnot.
Giving an excuse about why it’s okay that you, specifically, are doing it, and declaring that you’re “naming and shaming” on purpose, makes it worse. It’s already shaming the person without saying that you’re very aware that it is; you ought to be taking a “I’m sorry I have to do this” tone instead of a “I’m immune to repercussions, so I’m gonna make sure this stings extra!” tone.
At least, this is how it would work in the several relatively typical (American) social groups that I’m familiar with.
While I agree with your sentiment, I also care substantially more about the continued success and growth of solstices than about one or two participants of such events being deeply offended.
Elo is taking a stand here, which I believe needs to be taken, and few others are due to following the social norms of pre-emptively not offending people.
I admit I am confused; is sidestepping around the issue part of Ask or Guess culture?
I’m not asking for people not to talk about problems they have. I’m just criticizing the specifically extra-insensitive way of doing it in the comment I replied to. There are nicer, less intentionally hurtful ways to say the exact same thing.
Semi-related: This entire conversation has kind of wanted me to be able to see downvotes and upvotes tracked separately—I feel motivated to downvote the people who seem unnecessarily antagonistic to me, but I also very much want to see the upvotes showing solidarity with the complaint.
At present, they are. You can count the upvotes by looking at the point score. You can count the downvotes by saying quietly to yourself the number zero.
This doesn’t work for old comments, of course, because downvoting hasn’t always been disabled. Though if you hover your cursor over the net score it will give you a percent-positive figure, from which you can compute (provided it’s not 50% positive, and only approximately in some cases) how many upvotes and how many downvotes. It would be better if it said how many up and how many down rather than what percent positive.
Well, you could compute it by adding an upvote and seeing how much it changed. Not that it matters now that we’re on LW 2.0 and everything is different...
While I think it’s fine to call someone out by name if nothing else is working, I think the way you’re doing it is unnecessarily antagonistic and seemingly intentionally spiteful or at least utterly un-empathetic, and what you’re doing can (and in my opinion ought to) be done empathetically, for cohesion and not hurting people excessively and whatnot.
Giving an excuse about why it’s okay that you, specifically, are doing it, and declaring that you’re “naming and shaming” on purpose, makes it worse. It’s already shaming the person without saying that you’re very aware that it is; you ought to be taking a “I’m sorry I have to do this” tone instead of a “I’m immune to repercussions, so I’m gonna make sure this stings extra!” tone.
At least, this is how it would work in the several relatively typical (American) social groups that I’m familiar with.
While I agree with your sentiment, I also care substantially more about the continued success and growth of solstices than about one or two participants of such events being deeply offended.
Elo is taking a stand here, which I believe needs to be taken, and few others are due to following the social norms of pre-emptively not offending people.
I admit I am confused; is sidestepping around the issue part of Ask or Guess culture?
I’m not asking for people not to talk about problems they have. I’m just criticizing the specifically extra-insensitive way of doing it in the comment I replied to. There are nicer, less intentionally hurtful ways to say the exact same thing.
Yeah.
Semi-related: This entire conversation has kind of wanted me to be able to see downvotes and upvotes tracked separately—I feel motivated to downvote the people who seem unnecessarily antagonistic to me, but I also very much want to see the upvotes showing solidarity with the complaint.
At present, they are. You can count the upvotes by looking at the point score. You can count the downvotes by saying quietly to yourself the number zero.
(Downvoting is currently disabled.)
Oh right. :P
This doesn’t work for old comments, of course, because downvoting hasn’t always been disabled. Though if you hover your cursor over the net score it will give you a percent-positive figure, from which you can compute (provided it’s not 50% positive, and only approximately in some cases) how many upvotes and how many downvotes. It would be better if it said how many up and how many down rather than what percent positive.
Well, you could compute it by adding an upvote and seeing how much it changed. Not that it matters now that we’re on LW 2.0 and everything is different...