[ I don’t have strong opinions on the actual individuals or the posts they’ve made and/or objected to. I’ve both enjoyed and been annoyed by things that each of them have said, but nothing has triggered my “bad faith/useless/ignore” bit on either of them. I understand that I’m more thick-skinned than many, and I care less about this particular avenue of social reinforcement than many, so I will understand if others fall on the “something must be done” side of the line, even though I don’t. I’m mostly going to ask structural questions, rather than exploring communication or behavioral preferences/requirements. ]
Is there anything we can learn from the votes (especially from people who are neither the commenter nor the poster) on the possibly-objectionable threads and posts? Is this something moderation needs to address, or is voting sufficient (possibly with some tweaks to algorithm)?
Echoing Adam’s point, what is the budget that admins have for time spent policing subleties of fairly verbose engagement? None of the norms under discussion seem automatable, nor even cheap to detect/adjudicate. This isn’t spam, this isn’t short, obviously low-value comments, this is (apparently) well-thought-out, reasonable debate. Whether it’s useful or not, whether it’s well-motivated or not is insanely difficult to classify. Worse, any attempt to simplify will be subject to adversarial Goodhart (not implying actual intent to harm, but a legit difference of opinion over what “the problem” is, and what changes are needed).
[ I don’t have strong opinions on the actual individuals or the posts they’ve made and/or objected to. I’ve both enjoyed and been annoyed by things that each of them have said, but nothing has triggered my “bad faith/useless/ignore” bit on either of them. I understand that I’m more thick-skinned than many, and I care less about this particular avenue of social reinforcement than many, so I will understand if others fall on the “something must be done” side of the line, even though I don’t. I’m mostly going to ask structural questions, rather than exploring communication or behavioral preferences/requirements. ]
Is there anything we can learn from the votes (especially from people who are neither the commenter nor the poster) on the possibly-objectionable threads and posts? Is this something moderation needs to address, or is voting sufficient (possibly with some tweaks to algorithm)?
Echoing Adam’s point, what is the budget that admins have for time spent policing subleties of fairly verbose engagement? None of the norms under discussion seem automatable, nor even cheap to detect/adjudicate. This isn’t spam, this isn’t short, obviously low-value comments, this is (apparently) well-thought-out, reasonable debate. Whether it’s useful or not, whether it’s well-motivated or not is insanely difficult to classify. Worse, any attempt to simplify will be subject to adversarial Goodhart (not implying actual intent to harm, but a legit difference of opinion over what “the problem” is, and what changes are needed).