I have a hard time with the goal setting phase. Do I really want the goal? Would doing X really achieve the goal? Even if doing X achieves the goal would the cost be too high?
Sometimes I think this is akrasia other times I think it is being accurate that the goals are wrong.
In sense I have it easier because I have it harder. How to put it… lately I was wondering what advice would I give to my 14-16 years old former self. What are near-universally good goals? I cannot say with certainty if people should pursue their passion—if they have any at all—or go get a safely employable degree for example. So I don’t think I have life figured out, and don’t know I know what goals to set. But I am fairly sure of these three being good ideas for almost anyone almost al lthe time 1) don’t get hooked on drugs, booze, cigs or unhealthy food 2) improve your body, be fit, healthy, sexy, preferably through fun sports and not boring exercise 3) keep learning, all kinds of things.
The reason I have it easier because I have it harder is that I am hooked on booze (12 days dry though, with these methods) and unhealthy food (later) and my sporting is still a bit sporadic (also, fat) so these are very clear goals to set.
But if I was looking like a tennis player without addictions, would like salad, and read 3-4 new informative books a month (not just re-read old stuff or read fiction), I would find it hard to set new goals to be sure.
Do you think finding goals is easy? Because if it is hard, it does not sound like such an obvious idea. If goals are rare and hard to find, being good at fulfilling them pronto just makes a lot of empty bored time.
I think goals are a factor of environment: goal-rich environments are ones with high risk factor, where you could lose, and thus need to work hard to survive, but you could also win big. I would say, I am living in a safe and boring, goal-poor environment. The literal opposite of the Wild West.
I would say, I am living in a safe and boring, goal-poor environment.
With access to the internet, and the apparent time to use it, how are you goal poor?
My problem is more being overwhelmed by the options of what I might do. There are endless opportunities for improved health, fitness, and well being, at a time in history when radical life extension is a possibility. Or do those not count as big wins?
With access to the internet, and the apparent time to use it, how are you goal poor?
Easy. I am not given many duties. More below.
There are endless opportunities for improved health, fitness, and well being, at a time in history when radical life extension is a possibility. Or do those not count as big wins?
No. I don’t know how to explain it. I was not… raised… to live a self-centered life focusing on happiness. I feels wrong. My ingrained attitude is more like do the duties you are given. Fight the honorable fight of trying to provide your family a middle-class existence (my dad was born dirt poor, and not very first-worldy circumstances) and at 60 when your kids graudated college you may as well die as there are not many more duties to discharge. Perhaps, leave the wife a comfortable estate. (Dad died at 63, doing that.)
But I was not raised to be very altruistic either. I mean if I just wanted to overlook myself and work on improving humankind I could find many goals. But in my background it was more like focus on your immediate family, kin, blood.
At this point I don’t really care about living long or well-being. As my child came late, I am 37 and she is 1, I do need to fight on for 20-25 years, so I made some changes, stopped getting drunk daily (this is was too normal in my background, father-in-law still does it at 58), got into regular sports, made some diet changes, but I don’t know if I care much about well-being.
Besides, I had enough Buddhist / stoic influence to know chasing happiness or well-being is a losing race, as your desires always expand, it is better to desire less and be content with less rather than to get more. And it is easier and lazier.
Life extension scares me. I hardly have enough duties to fill out the 20-25 years I need to stay alive for the sake of my family, I don’t know how I would deal with having to make 70 or 80 with reduced mobility and things like that, a life where you cannot even get some minimal amount of tedium-reducing excitement from something like a boxing sparring because you are 75 scares me. While I love my family, part of me regrets the decision a bit, because if I stayed single then I would just need to pull on as long as my parents live, and I could be completely free and no duties owed afterwards, free to end it or to make dangerous, “bad” decisions like trying drugs or signing up to be a mercenary in a bush war or any of those kinds of deadly dangerous but definitely boredom-killing adventures.
Maybe things would be better if I would change careers, currently I am stuck in boring ERP software jobs (similar to SAP or Oracle, although not them), but I make more money than any of my relatives and I owe that kind of financial security for my family. But I never had a dream job and never understood why people can have passions for jobs, in my family job was just “travaille”, torture, something you must teeth-grindingly endure to be allowed to make a living by the Higher Ups which means bosses and politicians and generally Big People In Suits. So I don’t think I could fix anything by changing careers except endangering our safety.
Well, maybe it sounds depressing. I have no idea, since I never really raised to expect that kind of happiness where people run around smiling and enjoying jobs, I cannot really tell the difference between normalcy and functional depression. I don’t see that on my coworkers either, they come to the office because the bills won’t pay themselves but don’t look very overjoyed by it.
How does this work for you? Life extension, for example, how do you expect to fill out a day at 60 or 70? My mother got widowed at 60 and know she is trying to clean the house really slow so that she can pull it out for the whole day, to have something to do. Then repeats the next day. It is not easy. Since she has enough money that survival reflexes don’t motivate her and just like me chasing happiness is not on the table, what could she do? Same problem as me except that having a job and a child to raise makes me more occupied.
Sure. There are a lot of largely arbitrary goals of little practical use beyond exercising your goal fulfillment capabilities and developing your self control.
That’s largely what school is, a gym where you develop self control, and why it is a disaster for smart children who simply find no challenge in the level of work demanded. When the weights are just way too light, little training effect occurs.
I have a hard time with the goal setting phase. Do I really want the goal? Would doing X really achieve the goal? Even if doing X achieves the goal would the cost be too high? Sometimes I think this is akrasia other times I think it is being accurate that the goals are wrong.
In sense I have it easier because I have it harder. How to put it… lately I was wondering what advice would I give to my 14-16 years old former self. What are near-universally good goals? I cannot say with certainty if people should pursue their passion—if they have any at all—or go get a safely employable degree for example. So I don’t think I have life figured out, and don’t know I know what goals to set. But I am fairly sure of these three being good ideas for almost anyone almost al lthe time 1) don’t get hooked on drugs, booze, cigs or unhealthy food 2) improve your body, be fit, healthy, sexy, preferably through fun sports and not boring exercise 3) keep learning, all kinds of things.
The reason I have it easier because I have it harder is that I am hooked on booze (12 days dry though, with these methods) and unhealthy food (later) and my sporting is still a bit sporadic (also, fat) so these are very clear goals to set.
But if I was looking like a tennis player without addictions, would like salad, and read 3-4 new informative books a month (not just re-read old stuff or read fiction), I would find it hard to set new goals to be sure.
I’d say that there is one overriding concern.
Transform yourself into a goal fulfillment machine and get good at operating that machine.
Do you think finding goals is easy? Because if it is hard, it does not sound like such an obvious idea. If goals are rare and hard to find, being good at fulfilling them pronto just makes a lot of empty bored time.
I think goals are a factor of environment: goal-rich environments are ones with high risk factor, where you could lose, and thus need to work hard to survive, but you could also win big. I would say, I am living in a safe and boring, goal-poor environment. The literal opposite of the Wild West.
With access to the internet, and the apparent time to use it, how are you goal poor?
My problem is more being overwhelmed by the options of what I might do. There are endless opportunities for improved health, fitness, and well being, at a time in history when radical life extension is a possibility. Or do those not count as big wins?
Easy. I am not given many duties. More below.
No. I don’t know how to explain it. I was not… raised… to live a self-centered life focusing on happiness. I feels wrong. My ingrained attitude is more like do the duties you are given. Fight the honorable fight of trying to provide your family a middle-class existence (my dad was born dirt poor, and not very first-worldy circumstances) and at 60 when your kids graudated college you may as well die as there are not many more duties to discharge. Perhaps, leave the wife a comfortable estate. (Dad died at 63, doing that.)
But I was not raised to be very altruistic either. I mean if I just wanted to overlook myself and work on improving humankind I could find many goals. But in my background it was more like focus on your immediate family, kin, blood.
At this point I don’t really care about living long or well-being. As my child came late, I am 37 and she is 1, I do need to fight on for 20-25 years, so I made some changes, stopped getting drunk daily (this is was too normal in my background, father-in-law still does it at 58), got into regular sports, made some diet changes, but I don’t know if I care much about well-being.
Besides, I had enough Buddhist / stoic influence to know chasing happiness or well-being is a losing race, as your desires always expand, it is better to desire less and be content with less rather than to get more. And it is easier and lazier.
Life extension scares me. I hardly have enough duties to fill out the 20-25 years I need to stay alive for the sake of my family, I don’t know how I would deal with having to make 70 or 80 with reduced mobility and things like that, a life where you cannot even get some minimal amount of tedium-reducing excitement from something like a boxing sparring because you are 75 scares me. While I love my family, part of me regrets the decision a bit, because if I stayed single then I would just need to pull on as long as my parents live, and I could be completely free and no duties owed afterwards, free to end it or to make dangerous, “bad” decisions like trying drugs or signing up to be a mercenary in a bush war or any of those kinds of deadly dangerous but definitely boredom-killing adventures.
Maybe things would be better if I would change careers, currently I am stuck in boring ERP software jobs (similar to SAP or Oracle, although not them), but I make more money than any of my relatives and I owe that kind of financial security for my family. But I never had a dream job and never understood why people can have passions for jobs, in my family job was just “travaille”, torture, something you must teeth-grindingly endure to be allowed to make a living by the Higher Ups which means bosses and politicians and generally Big People In Suits. So I don’t think I could fix anything by changing careers except endangering our safety.
Well, maybe it sounds depressing. I have no idea, since I never really raised to expect that kind of happiness where people run around smiling and enjoying jobs, I cannot really tell the difference between normalcy and functional depression. I don’t see that on my coworkers either, they come to the office because the bills won’t pay themselves but don’t look very overjoyed by it.
How does this work for you? Life extension, for example, how do you expect to fill out a day at 60 or 70? My mother got widowed at 60 and know she is trying to clean the house really slow so that she can pull it out for the whole day, to have something to do. Then repeats the next day. It is not easy. Since she has enough money that survival reflexes don’t motivate her and just like me chasing happiness is not on the table, what could she do? Same problem as me except that having a job and a child to raise makes me more occupied.
I don’t think the OP is asking about what he could do—he is asking about what he would want to do.
It’s not a question of opportunities, but of motivation.
Sure. There are a lot of largely arbitrary goals of little practical use beyond exercising your goal fulfillment capabilities and developing your self control.
That’s largely what school is, a gym where you develop self control, and why it is a disaster for smart children who simply find no challenge in the level of work demanded. When the weights are just way too light, little training effect occurs.