The idea is that if you can’t get your quote published outside of Wikipedia, you shouldn’t put it in Wikipedia. Preferably, “outside” shouldn’t be your own blog, but something more respectable.
Yes, having it published outside would be the start. I live in a world where it’s easy for me to get things about Quantified Self published in relevant sources. I just have trouble placing something about my father in there to get his Wikipedia article factually correct. While he lived he wanted our press stories without entanglement.
It might be that I underrate the difficult that MIRI has with getting something published ‘outside’. I would expect that it should be easy to find a Wired journalist who is happy to write such a story.
But even if you can not find an actual journalist, write the article yourself. Most newspapers do publish meaningful op-eds. I would be surprised if you wouldn’t find a newspaper willing to publish it. It’s free content for them and MIRI is sort of authoritative, so there no reason not to publish the article provided it’s well written.
Getting something published in the Guardian’s Comment-is-free is also really easy and might be enough that most Wikipedia editors consider it “outside”.
Okay, let’s talk about consequences. You add a MIRI quote to Wikipedia, someone deletes it. You add it again, someone deletes it again and quotes some Wikipedia rule. You add it again and perhaps even say that you consider Wikipedia rules irrelevant in this specific case.
I probably wouldn’t engage in an edit war. I nowhere argued that you should be stupid about adding the article.
Yes, I do agree that you would want to go the road of getting the quote in some newspaper before you edit the Wikipedia article. Given that the article is about a topic with a lot of interest that what you need to do, to let the edit stick.
CiF might actually be a good place to get an op-ed placed. Note that they happily put a stupid headline on (its byline might as well be “Trolling is Free, Clicks are Sacred”) and hack up the text, all while putting your picture on, not paying you and bringing on the faeces-flinging monkeys in the comments (which one should never, ever read). But it might be of interest to them.
I live in a world where it’s easy for me to get things about Quantified Self published in relevant sources.
How much is because of the relevance of QS to the sources, and how much is your skill? I mean, if your skill plays an important role, perhaps you could volunteer for MIRI or CFAR as a media person. For example, they would give you the materials they produced, and you would try to get them in media (not Wikipedia, for the beginning).
It might be that I underrate the difficult that MIRI has with getting something published ‘outside’. I would expect that it should be easy to find a Wired journalist who is happy to write such a story.
I don’t know such details about MIRI; I am on the different side of the planet. You would have to ask them whether they are satisfied with their media output. Maybe they are, maybe they are not. Maybe they consider it a better use of their time to focus on something else (AI research), but would appreciate if someone else pushed their material to media. This is just my guess, but I think it’s worth asking. (Specifically: ask lukeprog.)
But even if you can not find an actual journalist, write the article yourself.
This is another way you could be helpful. Again, ask them. But I think that having a volunteer who pushes your material to media, and is good at doing it, is a great help for any organization.
How much is because of the relevance of QS to the sources, and how much is your skill? I mean, if your skill plays an important role, perhaps you could volunteer for MIRI or CFAR as a media person.
It’s difficult to judge your own skill. I was at the right place at the right time and therefore the first person to be featured in German newsmedia. I spoke in a way that was interesting and from there other journalists continue to contact me.
MIRI PR goals are also very different than the one of QS. QS basically wins if you can motivate individiuals to do QS and come to QS meetups.
It’s not necessary to convince the existing medical system that QS is good. MIRI on the other hand wins to the extend it can convince AI researchers to change their ways and to the extend it gets funders who donate money to it, to increase it’s output.
MIRI PR was to takes care to avoid antagonizing existing AI researchers. If I do QS PR I don’t want to associate with Big Pharma and can say things that might antagonize people.
I could imagine that I could contribute something to CFAR PR if CFAR would operate in Germany but currently that not the case. CFAR probably benefits from telling the story that it’s the new hot thing that much better than the awful status quo.
Should CFAR organise an event in Berlin, I could try to get a journalist to cover it.
But I think that having a volunteer who pushes your material to media, and is good at doing it, is a great help for any organization.
It’s not really a matter of pushing. but a matter of forming it in a way that the media wants it. Authenticity matters a great deal and if a journalist would get the feeling that I’m just pushing someone else’s statements the kind of work I did wouldn’t work as well.
From the mindset it’s much more that you have something they want and they have something you want.
A while ago I heard Jeff Hawkins say that the best way to get VC funding who started Palm is to play hard to get. The same thing might be true with regards to media.
In this case I think the film provides a good opportunity for setting up such a relationship for MIRI. Start by by visible at the beginning as someone authoritative who has something interesting to say about the film.
Afterwards I would expect journalists will be reaching out to MIRI and MIRI can provide them stuff that they want. That different than MIRI trying to push something on journalists.
Yes, having it published outside would be the start. I live in a world where it’s easy for me to get things about Quantified Self published in relevant sources. I just have trouble placing something about my father in there to get his Wikipedia article factually correct. While he lived he wanted our press stories without entanglement.
It might be that I underrate the difficult that MIRI has with getting something published ‘outside’. I would expect that it should be easy to find a Wired journalist who is happy to write such a story.
But even if you can not find an actual journalist, write the article yourself. Most newspapers do publish meaningful op-eds. I would be surprised if you wouldn’t find a newspaper willing to publish it. It’s free content for them and MIRI is sort of authoritative, so there no reason not to publish the article provided it’s well written.
Getting something published in the Guardian’s Comment-is-free is also really easy and might be enough that most Wikipedia editors consider it “outside”.
I probably wouldn’t engage in an edit war. I nowhere argued that you should be stupid about adding the article.
Yes, I do agree that you would want to go the road of getting the quote in some newspaper before you edit the Wikipedia article. Given that the article is about a topic with a lot of interest that what you need to do, to let the edit stick.
CiF might actually be a good place to get an op-ed placed. Note that they happily put a stupid headline on (its byline might as well be “Trolling is Free, Clicks are Sacred”) and hack up the text, all while putting your picture on, not paying you and bringing on the faeces-flinging monkeys in the comments (which one should never, ever read). But it might be of interest to them.
How much is because of the relevance of QS to the sources, and how much is your skill? I mean, if your skill plays an important role, perhaps you could volunteer for MIRI or CFAR as a media person. For example, they would give you the materials they produced, and you would try to get them in media (not Wikipedia, for the beginning).
I don’t know such details about MIRI; I am on the different side of the planet. You would have to ask them whether they are satisfied with their media output. Maybe they are, maybe they are not. Maybe they consider it a better use of their time to focus on something else (AI research), but would appreciate if someone else pushed their material to media. This is just my guess, but I think it’s worth asking. (Specifically: ask lukeprog.)
This is another way you could be helpful. Again, ask them. But I think that having a volunteer who pushes your material to media, and is good at doing it, is a great help for any organization.
It’s difficult to judge your own skill. I was at the right place at the right time and therefore the first person to be featured in German newsmedia. I spoke in a way that was interesting and from there other journalists continue to contact me.
MIRI PR goals are also very different than the one of QS. QS basically wins if you can motivate individiuals to do QS and come to QS meetups. It’s not necessary to convince the existing medical system that QS is good. MIRI on the other hand wins to the extend it can convince AI researchers to change their ways and to the extend it gets funders who donate money to it, to increase it’s output.
MIRI PR was to takes care to avoid antagonizing existing AI researchers. If I do QS PR I don’t want to associate with Big Pharma and can say things that might antagonize people.
I could imagine that I could contribute something to CFAR PR if CFAR would operate in Germany but currently that not the case. CFAR probably benefits from telling the story that it’s the new hot thing that much better than the awful status quo.
Should CFAR organise an event in Berlin, I could try to get a journalist to cover it.
It’s not really a matter of pushing. but a matter of forming it in a way that the media wants it. Authenticity matters a great deal and if a journalist would get the feeling that I’m just pushing someone else’s statements the kind of work I did wouldn’t work as well.
From the mindset it’s much more that you have something they want and they have something you want.
A while ago I heard Jeff Hawkins say that the best way to get VC funding who started Palm is to play hard to get. The same thing might be true with regards to media.
In this case I think the film provides a good opportunity for setting up such a relationship for MIRI. Start by by visible at the beginning as someone authoritative who has something interesting to say about the film.
Afterwards I would expect journalists will be reaching out to MIRI and MIRI can provide them stuff that they want. That different than MIRI trying to push something on journalists.
They are planning to do a workshop or a few of them in Europe. I don’t know more details, though.
Covering the event would be useful for next workshops and for the local LW meetups.