I would like to apologize that the discussion that I started has upset you. I feel partly responsible that you are upset and I’d like to remedy this.
I think that what you are feeling is part of the halo effect. When we see people who have some qualities we like (Understanding of logic, need for cognition, precise and methodical thought) we assume that they will also have other qualities we like and share our other values. So when someone within that doesn’t share them, it sticks out like a sore thumb.
It’s also a reminder that your other views don’t automatically come with the intelligence-rationality package. This reminder is good for your overall rationality. It forces you not to fall back on the “anyone who isn’t an idiot can see that I am right” defense.
But keep in mind Re: sore thumbs: In a rationalist community, Disagreement is salient, Agreement is silent.. Why was I even interested in Moldbug in the first place? Because he disagrees with me!
And now noticing all the terrifying, fascist-leaning political undercurrents that pervade the community
I show you this out to demonstrate the strong, silent agreement of social values on Lesswrong forums. We just don’t feel the need to talk about it, because all our opinions are assumed by default. The “undercurrents” that concern you are feeling distressed about are an overwhelming minority. They get attention because they disagree, and therefore they are interesting.
After you’ve finished with the “learning” phase, areas of disagreement mark the places worth watching, because that’s where you are likely to be wrong. That’s why in rationalist culture, the minority-view-holding-contrarian is always correspondingly louder. I’d argue that this is, on the whole, a good thing (coordination problems pointed out by E.Y. notwithstanding). This is the reason that despite my disagreement (which has emotional components aplenty—I know what it is like to be the target of racial discrimination) I am willing to really try considering such views dispassionately and on their own merits, making effort to put myself aside.
I hope that this makes you feel better about the whole thing.
I would like to apologize that the discussion that I started has upset you. I feel partly responsible that you are upset and I’d like to remedy this.
I think that what you are feeling is part of the halo effect. When we see people who have some qualities we like (Understanding of logic, need for cognition, precise and methodical thought) we assume that they will also have other qualities we like and share our other values. So when someone within that doesn’t share them, it sticks out like a sore thumb.
It’s also a reminder that your other views don’t automatically come with the intelligence-rationality package. This reminder is good for your overall rationality. It forces you not to fall back on the “anyone who isn’t an idiot can see that I am right” defense.
But keep in mind Re: sore thumbs: In a rationalist community, Disagreement is salient, Agreement is silent.. Why was I even interested in Moldbug in the first place? Because he disagrees with me!
This is from the Lesswrong 2012 survey:
POLITICS:
Liberal: 427, 36%
Libertarian: 359, 30.3%
Socialist: 326, 27.5%
Conservative: 35, 3%
Communist: 8, 0.7%
No answer: 30, 2.5%
ALTERNATIVE POLITICS QUESTION:
Progressive: 429, 36.3%
Libertarian: 278, 23.5%
Reactionary: 30, 2.5%
Conservative: 24, 2%
Communist: 22, 1.9%
Other: 156, 13.2%
ALTERNATIVE ALTERNATIVE POLITICS QUESTION:
Left-Libertarian: 102, 8.6%
Progressive: 98, 8.3%
Libertarian: 91, 7.7%
Pragmatist: 85, 7.2%
Social Democrat: 80, 6.8%
Socialist: 66, 5.6%
Anarchist: 50, 4.1%
Futarchist: 29, 2.5%
Moderate: 18, 1.5%
Moldbuggian: 19, 1.6%
Objectivist: 11, 0.9%
I show you this out to demonstrate the strong, silent agreement of social values on Lesswrong forums. We just don’t feel the need to talk about it, because all our opinions are assumed by default. The “undercurrents” that concern you are feeling distressed about are an overwhelming minority. They get attention because they disagree, and therefore they are interesting.
After you’ve finished with the “learning” phase, areas of disagreement mark the places worth watching, because that’s where you are likely to be wrong. That’s why in rationalist culture, the minority-view-holding-contrarian is always correspondingly louder. I’d argue that this is, on the whole, a good thing (coordination problems pointed out by E.Y. notwithstanding). This is the reason that despite my disagreement (which has emotional components aplenty—I know what it is like to be the target of racial discrimination) I am willing to really try considering such views dispassionately and on their own merits, making effort to put myself aside.
I hope that this makes you feel better about the whole thing.