I like hip-hop. I look at this after what I wrote and think “This may be like hip-hop.” Maybe that’s where our tastes part ways.
Hip-hop savors the sudden surprise stress, the in-line rhyme, the timing that makes you think “Why did that series of stressed S’es sound so fine?” Sublime.
Hip-hop savors the sudden surprise stress, the in-line rhyme, the timing that makes you think “Why did that series of stressed S’es sound so fine?” Sublime.
I don’t especially like hip hop—mostly because the content is usually unappealing (and content matters to me more than to most). But this quote doesn’t have the problems that the OP has. It mostly sounded catchy. Except the timing of the middle part feels a little bad to me because the phrases before and after prompt an expectation lyrical flow that isn’t maintained. If that is a part of hip-hop then I don’t like that either. :)
The abrupt interruption of lyrical flow is part of hip-hop. BBut, in exchange for that break, you get a rhyme structure that is far more complex than any usual lyrical poetry can deliver. To use my example, lyrical poetry could never present the LINE RHYME TIMing WHY FINE subLIME rhyming pattern with an offbeat. Instead of rhyming along a ruler, they rhyme along a parabola. I’m not trying to convince you to like hip-hop. I’m trying to point out the aesthetic that is there, that I like. Hip-hop artists do it way better than my silly off-the-cuff example, but I think I got the Fibonacci-vs-Cartesian feel close enough to hear.
I’m not trying to convince you to like hip-hop. I’m trying to point out the aesthetic that is there, that I like.
I understand, and you do a good job of explaining.
Hip-hop artists do it way better than my silly off-the-cuff example, but I think I got the Fibonacci-vs-Cartesian feel close enough to hear.
Even your efforts here feel somewhat more coherent than the poem and give a good indication of the aesthetic. I can see how it expresses the kind of cultural theme and attitude of those with whom it is most popular. Without, of course, needing to find either the cultural attitude or the style of expression even remotely appealing to me. Which is of course part of the point of music. It is an effective signal and screen to filter us into subcultures and identities that most suit our personality.
The content serves a similar purpose. I’m really not a ‘humans, transhumanism, yay!’ type so the poem wouldn’t be for me even if it had wedrifid compatible styling.
I think I grok you, wedrifid. I agree on the content valence.
I respond now only to say that the poem may be appreciable in ways other than my feeling like it’s sort of like hip-hop. I find myself the first totally positive critic here, but seriously, Swimmer, you have something there, if you want to do something with it. I’m just trying to offer my point of view.
I respond now only to say that the poem may be appreciable in ways other than my feeling like it’s sort of like hip-hop. I find myself the first totally positive critic here, but seriously, Swimmer, you have something there, if you want to do something with it. I’m just trying to offer my point of view.
Allow me to add for Swimmer’s benefit that I totally support the development of poetry for the benefit of yourself and others even when it completely doesn’t appeal to me. Most sophisticated poetry and art isn’t supposed to appeal to people like me. I have absolutely no problem with using lesswrong to present it or develop it and didn’t downvote it even on the main page (even though the folks may be right that it is more of a discussion thing.)
To be honest, if I read this poem written by someone else, I would probably think “whoa!” I’m not so much of a ‘transhumanism, yay!’ type either, but the last three lines randomly popped into my head, and they seemed suited to a poem about transhumanism rather than a poem about, say, flowers. Presenting ideas that jar with people a little bit is a good way to get comments, as demonstrated.
I don’t especially like hip hop—mostly because the content is usually unappealing (and content matters to me more than to most).
I like hip-hop musically, but dislike the content, and I get the sense that lots of people have this problem. I get around this by searching for hip-hop with incomprehensible lyrics or ideology I like. There is good rationalist hip-hop out there. Try Baba Brinkman, sample here. I’m not trying to convince anyone to like hip-hop, I’m just saying it’s out there.
I like it. The background music track sucks me in and the content more than makes up for the slightly-not-fitting words. ;)
Edit: Am I correct in assuming that his example is a little less distinctly hip-hop than, say, Unnamed’s examples. I’m no judge of hip-hop it just felt like Brinkman was putting the emphasis on the key points that fit the rhyme and rhythm of the music.
This guy is more making a statement “I’m a dominant male. Look how I can put the emphasis on the parts that don’t really fit in context or flow particularly elegantly. I must be baddass”. The latter is a legitimate signal to send, mind you, I just don’t feel the desire to affiliate with it whereas I would affiliate with Brinkman, who signals an somewhat different kind of status.
There’s a lot of variety in the content of hip hop. There’s introspective hip hop from Black Star, sci-fi from Deltron 3030, liberal politics from Blue Scholars, storytelling about innercity life from Capital D & The Molemen, clever wordplay from Binary Star, or music from Jurassic 5 where the words are like another instrument so you don’t have to worry about what they mean. If there are a few songs that you like, you can probably find more like them.
I like hip-hop. I look at this after what I wrote and think “This may be like hip-hop.” Maybe that’s where our tastes part ways.
Hip-hop savors the sudden surprise stress, the in-line rhyme, the timing that makes you think “Why did that series of stressed S’es sound so fine?” Sublime.
I don’t especially like hip hop—mostly because the content is usually unappealing (and content matters to me more than to most). But this quote doesn’t have the problems that the OP has. It mostly sounded catchy. Except the timing of the middle part feels a little bad to me because the phrases before and after prompt an expectation lyrical flow that isn’t maintained. If that is a part of hip-hop then I don’t like that either. :)
The abrupt interruption of lyrical flow is part of hip-hop. BBut, in exchange for that break, you get a rhyme structure that is far more complex than any usual lyrical poetry can deliver. To use my example, lyrical poetry could never present the LINE RHYME TIMing WHY FINE subLIME rhyming pattern with an offbeat. Instead of rhyming along a ruler, they rhyme along a parabola. I’m not trying to convince you to like hip-hop. I’m trying to point out the aesthetic that is there, that I like. Hip-hop artists do it way better than my silly off-the-cuff example, but I think I got the Fibonacci-vs-Cartesian feel close enough to hear.
I understand, and you do a good job of explaining.
Even your efforts here feel somewhat more coherent than the poem and give a good indication of the aesthetic. I can see how it expresses the kind of cultural theme and attitude of those with whom it is most popular. Without, of course, needing to find either the cultural attitude or the style of expression even remotely appealing to me. Which is of course part of the point of music. It is an effective signal and screen to filter us into subcultures and identities that most suit our personality.
The content serves a similar purpose. I’m really not a ‘humans, transhumanism, yay!’ type so the poem wouldn’t be for me even if it had wedrifid compatible styling.
I think I grok you, wedrifid. I agree on the content valence.
I respond now only to say that the poem may be appreciable in ways other than my feeling like it’s sort of like hip-hop. I find myself the first totally positive critic here, but seriously, Swimmer, you have something there, if you want to do something with it. I’m just trying to offer my point of view.
Allow me to add for Swimmer’s benefit that I totally support the development of poetry for the benefit of yourself and others even when it completely doesn’t appeal to me. Most sophisticated poetry and art isn’t supposed to appeal to people like me. I have absolutely no problem with using lesswrong to present it or develop it and didn’t downvote it even on the main page (even though the folks may be right that it is more of a discussion thing.)
To be honest, if I read this poem written by someone else, I would probably think “whoa!” I’m not so much of a ‘transhumanism, yay!’ type either, but the last three lines randomly popped into my head, and they seemed suited to a poem about transhumanism rather than a poem about, say, flowers. Presenting ideas that jar with people a little bit is a good way to get comments, as demonstrated.
I like hip-hop musically, but dislike the content, and I get the sense that lots of people have this problem. I get around this by searching for hip-hop with incomprehensible lyrics or ideology I like. There is good rationalist hip-hop out there. Try Baba Brinkman, sample here. I’m not trying to convince anyone to like hip-hop, I’m just saying it’s out there.
I like it. The background music track sucks me in and the content more than makes up for the slightly-not-fitting words. ;)
Edit: Am I correct in assuming that his example is a little less distinctly hip-hop than, say, Unnamed’s examples. I’m no judge of hip-hop it just felt like Brinkman was putting the emphasis on the key points that fit the rhyme and rhythm of the music.
This guy is more making a statement “I’m a dominant male. Look how I can put the emphasis on the parts that don’t really fit in context or flow particularly elegantly. I must be baddass”. The latter is a legitimate signal to send, mind you, I just don’t feel the desire to affiliate with it whereas I would affiliate with Brinkman, who signals an somewhat different kind of status.
There’s a lot of variety in the content of hip hop. There’s introspective hip hop from Black Star, sci-fi from Deltron 3030, liberal politics from Blue Scholars, storytelling about innercity life from Capital D & The Molemen, clever wordplay from Binary Star, or music from Jurassic 5 where the words are like another instrument so you don’t have to worry about what they mean. If there are a few songs that you like, you can probably find more like them.
Thank you. I will check some of these guys out.