I could describe the specifics, but the main thing is just… ritualspace is big, and rather than trying to define what True Ritual means very specifically, it’s better to just… acknowledge that it is big.
Ritual is more of a cluster than something clearly defined, but I’d say the central things of properly done ritual are:
some kind of sacrifice (minimum viable sacrifice is time, which is a bit of a cop-out but not unreasonable. Solstice strives for a sacrifice of the form “experience things that are sad/unsettling”)
symbolic and emotional power that transforms the participants (this requires their awareness and assent)
I’m not sure if everyone in this thread would agree with that definition, but I’m guessing it’s pretty close. I very much want Solstice to have those things.
Clapping can push against that… but I don’t think there’s anything intrinsic to that, or that the effect is so strong as to destroy all ritualconcepts.
Clapping does ruin the solemn darkness, and certain kinds of sacredness. But my ideal Solstice has at least some songs that end with a bunch of excited energy (as well as appreciation) built up in me and clapping seems like an okay way to express that in those moments.
Clapping, for cultural reasons, does tend to send the message that you are an audience rather than participants. I think this is particularly the case when you’re in the “seating + stage” setup we usually have. But even this varies:
Imagine a Solstice that’s more like a Viking Banquet, where part of the thing that’s happening is we’re honoring the people who have done great things this year, and the clapping isn’t a “we are an audience thing” so much as a “we are a community honoring our people” thing. (Relatedly, in a hypothetical solstice where the audience was always singing along, where they were seated in a circle, where there were no visible lead performers, I can imagine clapping happening that feels like “we just did a cool thing together and we’re excited” rather than “good job people on stage who are Not Us”)
Basically I think the clapping is a factor, just not an overwhelming one if the rest of Solstice is done right.
How would you characterize the different kinds of ritual?
I could describe the specifics, but the main thing is just… ritualspace is big, and rather than trying to define what True Ritual means very specifically, it’s better to just… acknowledge that it is big.
Ritual is more of a cluster than something clearly defined, but I’d say the central things of properly done ritual are:
some kind of sacrifice (minimum viable sacrifice is time, which is a bit of a cop-out but not unreasonable. Solstice strives for a sacrifice of the form “experience things that are sad/unsettling”)
symbolic and emotional power that transforms the participants (this requires their awareness and assent)
I’m not sure if everyone in this thread would agree with that definition, but I’m guessing it’s pretty close. I very much want Solstice to have those things.
Clapping can push against that… but I don’t think there’s anything intrinsic to that, or that the effect is so strong as to destroy all ritualconcepts.
Clapping does ruin the solemn darkness, and certain kinds of sacredness. But my ideal Solstice has at least some songs that end with a bunch of excited energy (as well as appreciation) built up in me and clapping seems like an okay way to express that in those moments.
Clapping, for cultural reasons, does tend to send the message that you are an audience rather than participants. I think this is particularly the case when you’re in the “seating + stage” setup we usually have. But even this varies:
Imagine a Solstice that’s more like a Viking Banquet, where part of the thing that’s happening is we’re honoring the people who have done great things this year, and the clapping isn’t a “we are an audience thing” so much as a “we are a community honoring our people” thing. (Relatedly, in a hypothetical solstice where the audience was always singing along, where they were seated in a circle, where there were no visible lead performers, I can imagine clapping happening that feels like “we just did a cool thing together and we’re excited” rather than “good job people on stage who are Not Us”)
Basically I think the clapping is a factor, just not an overwhelming one if the rest of Solstice is done right.