The bathtub was supposed to illustrate the collective property notion, not the status-quo notion.
Well that clears things up then. I realize you never included the word “further”, but I had to insert it in order to use your bathtub example to interpret the status quo notion in any meaningful way.
Assuming that had been your intent, the implied reductio was very much part of my point. I didn’t think you would want the factory to continue dumping waste, which is why I thought your argument about “status quo” was flawed.
But since you’ve clarified your position, I lift that particular objection.
Having reread your comments with the context of that clarification, I now understand what you meant and I sort of agree, with caveats.
If there is no clear winner among the possible states of affairs in consideration, then it makes sense to default to the state of affairs that requires no action. And I agree that future humans have rights insofar as it isn’t fair to “use up” nature in the present, leaving future generations with polluted wastelands.
However, I don’t think that uncertainty about the preferences of future humans should leave us unable to make changes to the current state of nature.
messing with nature is going to be stealing it from somebody who was entitled to its being left alone.
This may be true, but if we collectively think in the present that some change is a generally good idea overall, we shouldn’t maintain the status quo just because we’re worried that people in the future might disagree and want nature left alone. We should guess at what their preferences will be and take that into account so that we can move forward.
Otherwise, we’d never be able to change anything about nature that we don’t like.
This may be true, but if we collectively think in the present that some change is a generally good idea overall, we shouldn’t maintain the status quo just because we’re worried that people in the future might disagree and want nature left alone. We should guess at what their preferences will be and take that into account so that we can move forward.
Well that clears things up then. I realize you never included the word “further”, but I had to insert it in order to use your bathtub example to interpret the status quo notion in any meaningful way.
Assuming that had been your intent, the implied reductio was very much part of my point. I didn’t think you would want the factory to continue dumping waste, which is why I thought your argument about “status quo” was flawed.
But since you’ve clarified your position, I lift that particular objection.
Having reread your comments with the context of that clarification, I now understand what you meant and I sort of agree, with caveats.
If there is no clear winner among the possible states of affairs in consideration, then it makes sense to default to the state of affairs that requires no action. And I agree that future humans have rights insofar as it isn’t fair to “use up” nature in the present, leaving future generations with polluted wastelands.
However, I don’t think that uncertainty about the preferences of future humans should leave us unable to make changes to the current state of nature.
This may be true, but if we collectively think in the present that some change is a generally good idea overall, we shouldn’t maintain the status quo just because we’re worried that people in the future might disagree and want nature left alone. We should guess at what their preferences will be and take that into account so that we can move forward.
Otherwise, we’d never be able to change anything about nature that we don’t like.
For all practical purposes, I agree completely.