What’s the deal with spells and age? If Harry is really so far ahead of his class and can already cast spells nobody else can, why is it just now that he can cast “second-year” spells effortlessly?
Canon or not, this reminds me too much of the public school system of a certain country where kids are verboten to use words “they shouldn’t know yet”.
“For some reason or other,” said the amused voice of Professor Quirrell, “it seems that the scion of Malfoy is able to cast surprisingly strong magic for a first-year student. Due to the purity of his blood, of course. Certainly the good Lord Malfoy would not have openly flouted the underage magic laws by arranging for his son to receive a wand before his acceptance into Hogwarts.”
and
Only there was a reason why they usually didn’t bother giving wands to nine-year-olds. Age counted too, it wasn’t just how long you’d held a wand. Granger’s birthday had been only a few days into the year, when Harry had bought her that pouch. That meant she was twelve now, that she’d been twelve almost since the start of Hogwarts. And the truth was, Draco hadn’t been practicing much outside of class, probably not nearly as much as Hermione Granger of Ravenclaw. Draco hadn’t thought he needed any more practice to stay ahead...
So from this it seems magic power increases with age, spells cast and time since first getting your wand (though the third could simply be due to the second)
So the reason Harry can only just now cast second year spells, is that he has only recently become sufficiently powerful. His partial transfiguration and patronous v2.0 don’t actually require a lot of spell power they only require you to do clever things.
I’ve always modeled it as a physiological “mana capacity” aspect akin to muscle mass—something that grows both naturally as a developing body matures, and as a result of exercise.
I would speculate that there’s some physiological component involved in spellcasting ability that grows with age, in much the same way that older children are often more coordinated and stronger than younger children. I have no evidence to back this up other than the repeated mentions of ‘age matters with spells’, however.
It is practice. Why is, pardon, why was Hermione so much better in spells then others? Because of practice. Other children do not practice as much as Harry, or as much as Hermione did… It was somewhat suggested in part where Harry and Draco talk about muggle-borns, pure-bloods and magic.
Harry completely started using magic when he went to Hogwarts. If he has basically learned year one and year two in one year I think that’s okay.
Canon or not, this reminds me too much of the public school system of a certain country where kids are verboten to use words “they shouldn’t know yet”.
Not a public school, but in 5th grade I wrote a short paper about Ferdinand Magellan and used the word “circumnavigate.” My teacher accused me of copying, and I had to rewrite the paper using smaller words.
The word “circumnavigate” is always used with Magellan—it may as well be his middle name. It’s used in the first two sentences on Magellan’s page at La Wik.
My guess is the teacher didn’t know know the word, found out it was a real one, and found it emotionally satisfying to punish a child for assaulting his status by demonstrating his ignorance, however unintentionally.
Some people feel very threatened by “big words” they don’t know, and see use of language as a status play.
Years ago, one guy at work, who I actually consider very sharp, if not educated to the degree his intelligence allowed, stormed off in a huff with a parting shot saying I was “using big words to show I was better than he was.” ?????
That was a very poor reading of me, but a huge window into his own motivations and insecurities. I think that weirdness is actually common in some poorer and less educated subcultures.
The word “circumnavigate” is always used with Magellan—it may as well be his middle name. It’s used in the first two sentences on Magellan’s page at La Wik.
If the student in question uses the word not because it was in his usual vocabulary but because it appeared in the article about Magellan, the teacher has a valid point. A five grade student who reads an article about Magellan might copy the word without understanding it.
A teacher who wants to check whether the students actually understand is going to want that the student expresses his ideas within their own vocabulary and not simply copy words of an article they read.
I personally had teachers not understand a point I made because of not understanding that strategy and tactics are two different words with different meaning but I hadn’t an issue with teacher complaining that I’m not speaking in my own vocabulary when writing essays.
If the student in question uses the word not because it was in his usual vocabulary but because it appeared in the article about Magellan, the teacher has a valid point.
Not really. I’m sure “circumnavigate” wasn’t in my usual vocabulary but its meaning is simple enough to determine from context. I don’t think its reasonable to penalize someone for using a word they would pretty much have to pick up when learning about a topic.
The other thing about this educational strategy is that, all other effects aside, it discourages students from using more sophisticated vocabulary. If you try to use a complicated word and get it wrong, you will be punished. If you get it right but the teacher doesn’t believe you did so deliberately, you will also be punished. That’s a terrible lesson to teach children (or anyone else).
If the student in question uses the word not because it was in his usual vocabulary but because it appeared in the article about Magellan, the teacher has a valid point.
One of the points of being a student is to expand your vocabulary. You see a word used, you use it yourself. “Circumnavigation” is not a complicated concept. If you use it incorrectly, then the teacher should correct you. But don’t tell a student to stay away from the big scary word.
but I hadn’t an issue with teacher complaining that I’m not speaking in my own vocabulary when writing essays.
??? Words become your vocabulary by you using them, and that’s all the more true when you’re young and still developing your vocabulary.
There such a thing as “guessing the teachers” password. It’s a failure condition.
It’s a frequent exercise to read a text and rephrase it in your own words to show that you understood the text. It creates mental connections between the new information to which you are exposed and to what you already know.
Essay writing is about “transfer” at least it was what I was taught in school.
What’s the deal with spells and age? If Harry is really so far ahead of his class and can already cast spells nobody else can, why is it just now that he can cast “second-year” spells effortlessly?
Canon or not, this reminds me too much of the public school system of a certain country where kids are verboten to use words “they shouldn’t know yet”.
These seem to be the relevant quotes:
and
-both hpmor ch.78
So from this it seems magic power increases with age, spells cast and time since first getting your wand (though the third could simply be due to the second)
So the reason Harry can only just now cast second year spells, is that he has only recently become sufficiently powerful. His partial transfiguration and patronous v2.0 don’t actually require a lot of spell power they only require you to do clever things.
I’ve always modeled it as a physiological “mana capacity” aspect akin to muscle mass—something that grows both naturally as a developing body matures, and as a result of exercise.
I would speculate that there’s some physiological component involved in spellcasting ability that grows with age, in much the same way that older children are often more coordinated and stronger than younger children. I have no evidence to back this up other than the repeated mentions of ‘age matters with spells’, however.
It is practice. Why is, pardon, why was Hermione so much better in spells then others? Because of practice. Other children do not practice as much as Harry, or as much as Hermione did… It was somewhat suggested in part where Harry and Draco talk about muggle-borns, pure-bloods and magic.
Harry completely started using magic when he went to Hogwarts. If he has basically learned year one and year two in one year I think that’s okay.
Link?
Not a public school, but in 5th grade I wrote a short paper about Ferdinand Magellan and used the word “circumnavigate.” My teacher accused me of copying, and I had to rewrite the paper using smaller words.
There’s a stupid teacher.
In this case it seems very much like the decision of an individual teacher and not broad educational policy.
Every strategy for plagiarism detection is also going to have false positives.
The word “circumnavigate” is always used with Magellan—it may as well be his middle name. It’s used in the first two sentences on Magellan’s page at La Wik.
My guess is the teacher didn’t know know the word, found out it was a real one, and found it emotionally satisfying to punish a child for assaulting his status by demonstrating his ignorance, however unintentionally.
Some people feel very threatened by “big words” they don’t know, and see use of language as a status play.
Years ago, one guy at work, who I actually consider very sharp, if not educated to the degree his intelligence allowed, stormed off in a huff with a parting shot saying I was “using big words to show I was better than he was.” ?????
That was a very poor reading of me, but a huge window into his own motivations and insecurities. I think that weirdness is actually common in some poorer and less educated subcultures.
If the student in question uses the word not because it was in his usual vocabulary but because it appeared in the article about Magellan, the teacher has a valid point. A five grade student who reads an article about Magellan might copy the word without understanding it.
A teacher who wants to check whether the students actually understand is going to want that the student expresses his ideas within their own vocabulary and not simply copy words of an article they read.
I personally had teachers not understand a point I made because of not understanding that strategy and tactics are two different words with different meaning but I hadn’t an issue with teacher complaining that I’m not speaking in my own vocabulary when writing essays.
Not really. I’m sure “circumnavigate” wasn’t in my usual vocabulary but its meaning is simple enough to determine from context. I don’t think its reasonable to penalize someone for using a word they would pretty much have to pick up when learning about a topic.
The other thing about this educational strategy is that, all other effects aside, it discourages students from using more sophisticated vocabulary. If you try to use a complicated word and get it wrong, you will be punished. If you get it right but the teacher doesn’t believe you did so deliberately, you will also be punished. That’s a terrible lesson to teach children (or anyone else).
One of the points of being a student is to expand your vocabulary. You see a word used, you use it yourself. “Circumnavigation” is not a complicated concept. If you use it incorrectly, then the teacher should correct you. But don’t tell a student to stay away from the big scary word.
??? Words become your vocabulary by you using them, and that’s all the more true when you’re young and still developing your vocabulary.
There such a thing as “guessing the teachers” password. It’s a failure condition.
It’s a frequent exercise to read a text and rephrase it in your own words to show that you understood the text. It creates mental connections between the new information to which you are exposed and to what you already know. Essay writing is about “transfer” at least it was what I was taught in school.