(not sure if this was clear, but I don’t feel strongly about which definition to use, I just wanted to disambiguate between definitions people might have been using)
I think that Eliezer’s other usage of “instrumental rationality” points to fields of study for theoretical underpinning of effective action.
This sounds right-ish (i.e. this sounds like something he might have meant). When I said “use probability and game theory and stuff” I didn’t mean “be a slave to whatever tools we happen to use right now”, I meant sort of as examples of “things you might use if you were trying to base your decisions and actions off of sound theoretical underpinnings.”
So I guess the thing I’m still unclear on (people’s common usage of words): Do most LWers think it is reasonable to call something “instrumentally rational” if you just sorta went with your gut without ever doing any kind of reflection (assuming your gut turned out to be trustworthy?).
Or are things only instrumentally rational if you had theoretical underpinnings? (Your definition says “no”, which seems fine. But it might leave you with an awkward distinction between “instrumentally rational decisions” and “decisions rooted in instrumental rationality.”)
I’m still unsure if this is dissolving confusion, or if the original post still seems like it needs editing.
Your definition says “no”, which seems fine. But it might leave you with an awkward distinction between “instrumentally rational decisions” and “decisions rooted in instrumental rationality.”
My definition was the first, which is “instrumental rationality = acting so you winyour values”. So, wouldn’t it say that following your gut was instrumentally rational? At least, if it’s a great idea in expectation given what you knew—I wouldn’t say lottery winners were instrumentally rational.
I guess the hangup is in pinning down “when things are actually good ideas in expectation”, given that it’s harder to know that without either lots of experience or clear theoretical underpinnings.
I think one of the things I was aiming for with Being a Robust Agent is “you set up the longterm goal of having your policies and actions have knowably good outcomes, which locally might be a setback for how capable you are, but allows you to reliably achieve longer term goals.”
(not sure if this was clear, but I don’t feel strongly about which definition to use, I just wanted to disambiguate between definitions people might have been using)
This sounds right-ish (i.e. this sounds like something he might have meant). When I said “use probability and game theory and stuff” I didn’t mean “be a slave to whatever tools we happen to use right now”, I meant sort of as examples of “things you might use if you were trying to base your decisions and actions off of sound theoretical underpinnings.”
So I guess the thing I’m still unclear on (people’s common usage of words): Do most LWers think it is reasonable to call something “instrumentally rational” if you just sorta went with your gut without ever doing any kind of reflection (assuming your gut turned out to be trustworthy?).
Or are things only instrumentally rational if you had theoretical underpinnings? (Your definition says “no”, which seems fine. But it might leave you with an awkward distinction between “instrumentally rational decisions” and “decisions rooted in instrumental rationality.”)
I’m still unsure if this is dissolving confusion, or if the original post still seems like it needs editing.
My definition was the first, which is “instrumental rationality = acting so you winyour values”. So, wouldn’t it say that following your gut was instrumentally rational? At least, if it’s a great idea in expectation given what you knew—I wouldn’t say lottery winners were instrumentally rational.
I guess the hangup is in pinning down “when things are actually good ideas in expectation”, given that it’s harder to know that without either lots of experience or clear theoretical underpinnings.
I think one of the things I was aiming for with Being a Robust Agent is “you set up the longterm goal of having your policies and actions have knowably good outcomes, which locally might be a setback for how capable you are, but allows you to reliably achieve longer term goals.”